:DD

Age: 14

next thread pls

so he was six when he signed up?

his mom did so he would be busy

oh no, someone flames quakelive, news at 20

news at 20? hmm

thats 8pm

I bet you're over 5 stone innit

i fink most pplz are mate

I'm glad they banned you, ESR should do the same.

Useless complaining is useless

nothing productive ever gets done in there anyways, mostly just ass kissing on every terrible change.

Wrong, if you actually paid attention, you would see a lot of constructive feedback and discussions going on.

rofl, gillz please, you and i both know that it tends to go:


'test these double jumps'
'OH MAN COOLEST FUCKING ADDITION EVER HOLY FUCK'
'WOW MAN WHAT DID WE DO BEFORE THIS'

it's not healthy gillz, it really isnt

There was more complaints about it than anything else.

You seemed to miss people like noctis and jones spending hours testing all combinations of pmove cvars, giving feedback, etc.

It's pretty apparent you barely read that channel.

Noctis and jones, excellent examples.

jones who sucks more cock than sponge on a friday night and noctis whose, well, noctis?

I've read the channel countless times and laughed endlessly about how discussions tend to go. You have the clueless nobodies and the same 5 people who agree with pretty much every change that occurs.

And yes, hurray for testing all combination of pmove cvars. Big innovation removing hardcoded values into a cvar, excellent work there.

It must suck being so terribly delusional that you actually believe what you suggest counts for something there. Or you know, believing a 'developer' who will sit there and lie to you about how physic changes were needed to be done because of netcode.

Get a clue, Gillz. Please, for the sake of esr.

They're testing the combination of pmove cvars to get a BETTER MOVEMENT SYSTEM FOR QUAKE LIVE, how fucking stupid can you be? You know for a fact that Noctis would go to Quake 3 in a second, so don't try to tell me he's sucking the dick of ID software.

The suggestions ARE taken into consideration, you just fail to see it. Oh look, I made a duel scoreboard, now they're making a new duel scoreboard. I GUESS THEY DON'T TAKE SUGGESTIONS RIGHT?

You sit here and talk shit about everyone else, when you've contributed what? Where are you trying to improve the game and make it better? No, you just sit, idle, troll. Rinse and repeat. Enjoy getting banned from the focus channel.

Raped idiot.

c-c-c-combo breaker

you mention the duel scoreboard, now although i will welcome it and it is nice so dont think im hating on it, but its a prettier cpma scoreboard with a few extra bits of info. this is the kind of thing that should have been implemented without people needing to suggest it. im sure their graphics artists (or whichever person makes things looks nice) could have used the cpma style scoreboard and made it nice.

"im sure their graphics artists"

I guess that's the problem.

get adrian carmack back!

yeah what a joke.
the need of a decent scoreboard (not just for duel) was voiced over and over in the suggestion forums and here on esr aswell, i made a thread about it myself soon after the public beta started. but nothing happened although it so obvious and id shouldnt even need us to remind them that their current scoreboard is shit.
but apparently they need a few month to do one anyway, judging from the fact that gillz says they will use his suggestion. dunno if i should laugh or cry

thx for imsg with warning, my imsg is deactivated, sorry..

you're gonna clear esr of trolls by going head-on with each of them?

Raged. The only thing raped was Quake Live. Who is to blame? id software.

hello

http://www.esreality.com/index.php?a=post&id=1478983

2007 would like a word with you.

You sit here and talk shit about everyone else, when you've contributed what? Where are you trying to improve the game and make it better?

Thats the problem, you cant contribute anything to development of the game since its not public...but then again I though giving constructive criticism is somekind of contribution itself, right!?
And if nazi id cant handle the criticism and theire even banning ppl for thinking with their own heads, then its the only right thing to do, to come here and diss them on ESR.They should set some priorities that are really important for the game and community, instead of toying around with some ridiculous colors,pmove etc.

They should set some priorities that are really important for the game and community

haven't 10 years of Q3 mods taught you anything?


I mean besides the obvious gtv and maps (which are slowly coming) and LAN support for everyone prolly not happeing for economic reasons, there isn't too much 'important' stuff that everyone will agree one.

Cause I for one can vividly remember that Q3 had contant whine about weapons belances and other stuff. But it was not nearly everyone agreeing but always just group wanting this or that. (Just look at excessive plus, and how osp and cpma players view it).

So no, looking at what the community wants will never give you any final results in the Q3/QL community. Just even more whine if listen to "that group of idiots" instead of "us, who know much better". So, it turns out to be a better tactic not accept any input directly and take some whine for it. Cause else people will start believing if "that stupid change from that moron got it" they are entitled to have their change put in as well".

-> give someone an inch, and he'll want a mile

I'm willing to bet, if id started to listen directly they would never be able to finish the game to everyone's satisfaction and would most likely make people feel even more frustrated with them.


/edit

I'm not just talking out of my ass, btw.
Everyone who works on projects with a direct link to the customer will tell you the same: If you don't give a deadline to a customer and tell him that all requests after that will cost extra, you run a very high risk of ruining the project and spending much more time on it than was calculated.
It's the worst for customers who think they are experts on the matter, but really just make singular demands without checking the big picture.

I'm willing to bet, if id started to listen directly they would never be able to finish the game to everyone's satisfaction

So pretty much the same that it is now? You're always going to have people whine for no reason, just as you'll always have people who praise it without question. It's just odd that id will even ignore things that all parties can agree on - like GTV.

nice quoting skills, if you read on you will see that I wrote that I'm willing to bet that matters would get worse if they started to directly implement community input. ;)

Been wondering about the lack of gtv myself, though

I wasn't disagreeing with you; I was just pointing out that the above is already true. While they could try things the way you described before the game came out, it's obviously not working for them now. It could be worse, but even if it was, they don't have much to lose.

ok.

But I do think they have something to lose. And that is a deadline for finishing the major parts (i.e. everything besides server management, news maps and the occasional tweak of the web interface)

Which is why I believe demanding more "community involvement" is not a good idea, even if there is the small chance it might produce a slightly better game in the long run.

What major parts are left, and shouldn't that have been done before it left closed beta? I see a more steady and productive development strategy by the guy who makes minecraft, and he's just one man. Listening to the community is working out for him, though.

they just tweaked the movement a bit. Not really a thing they _had_ to do, but they did make a change to a major part of the game.

Minecraft is a sandbox game, the entire concept is basically about adding new stuff, so it is not a very good analogy. (Just imagine how people would react if id started to add a new weapon to QL every week ;P)
It is really young compared to Quake. In early stages listening to the community ( / customer) is good but over time it becomes less and less so (this is also far more true for changes than for additions!).
Eventually you will need a deadline, not 100 more discussions.


Just imagine this:

id goes all-out on a community integration for QL developement, maybe with polls about what values should be set etc. Even if they do manage to get through the following chaos with QL, the worst part is ahead of them:

And that is when id make Doom 4 or Quake 5, the community / future customers, will demand the same influence as they had with QL. Developments costs will sky-rocket.

As a point in case: if no game ever had allowed custom maps, people would be a lot happier with getting 40 different maps (or how many QL has) than they are now.

but they DID ask - they just threw the information out. Don't you remember the sticky 1500+ post QZ sandbox thread that was requested by Sync? He was active as hell on this site up until his wife made a fool of herself.

Even the most basic of suggestions (some of which were very good!) were ignored, and the most obvious features (GTV) are still missing. I don't advocate listening to everyone, but they're not even interested in good ideas, or constructive criticism.

yes, and the thread was at the very start of the project called Quakelive. And it was also a "give us ideas and we'll see what we'll use for our project" kind-of deal. And I already said, that in the beginning getting ideas is good, but that benefit simply becomes less and less.

Kinda like a car company asking the public for random ideas when they want to start a new model. They might or or might not use some of that input. But on thing is for sure: They are not going to ask their customers later in the project, whether they want 250 or 280 hp, let alone what kind of transmission fluid they would prefer ;)


/edit

as for listening, whether something is a good idea or not is often a very subjective idea!
And listening to constructive criticism, while banning for it is only ok when it degrades into spam, it is exactly what I am talking about this whole time:

If you start to openly listen to actual constructive criticism, people will just hammer you with their ideas, label them "constructive criticism" and start raging when you don't reply to each and every one of them. Again and again. In endless discussions.

You have a nightmare on your hands and are not getting anywhere with your project.

That doesn't mean, you shouldn't read the stuff and put it in if and whenever it makes sense. Just don't do it openly.

According to them, they wanted more:

The Quake Zero approach is to have it readily available and anyone can play it. It's focused more on the sporting element. We want to get that done, get that in to people's hands and get some feedback from them. -Todd Hollenshead, 2007

The game obviously needed player feedback, as Q3 didn't get it right the first time. They had the chance to use it before it left closed beta, and they didn't. They had the chance to use it (and the new feedback) during open beta, and they didn't. The game is no longer beta, and now it doesn't matter either way.

A car manufacturer would ask for such values, if the car in question was to be used in events where those values needed to be specific.

to your edit: but they're not doing that - they've asked for feedback, then ignored/banned ALL of it. (even as early as closed beta!)

you just quoted an obvious marketing quote ...

I mean if you go by that, every car manufacturer has the best car in the world.


As for that rest, they certainly did not ignore ALL of it, but I suppose it was inevitable that your general opinion would shine through in this otherwise good discussion, so let this be the end of it then.

Would you prefer the same quotes from Syncerror in his (pre wife failure) community interaction?

No, really - what feedback has been used? What constructive criticism has even been acknowledged? Hell, they haven't even fixed the obvious bugs.

here is the link http://www.esreality.com/index.php?a=post&id=1496184

I know it's futile to discuss it with you. But for everyone who reads your last post and wonders if you might have a point. They can just click, look around and see for themselves. :)

Yes, I linked to that very thread... in this thread.

Please, what did they take from that thread? What did they take from closed beta feedback threads? (hell, were you even in closed beta?) What have they taken from open beta feedback?

edit: oh wait, I think I found one. Didn't they add XBOX 360 controller support? That was a popular thread in closed beta... around when they locked the constructive criticism LG thread.

SyncError responded about GTV on ESR before:

"3) Is a GTV option going to be available and Is there any truth to comments that it's being held off due to organizations preferring to have their tournaments stream-only therefore satisfying sponsors?

<SyncError> 3) We hope to make it available, but no ETA. No, there is no truth to events or sponsors asking us to keep it stream-only. "

Also one of the changelogs made a few months ago was flamed for not bringing anything 'new' but let you view players on LAN-event serves, and Syncerror responded to some flames that it was in part work that would be a requirement for any GTV type system.

A lot of people on here flatly state things are 'ignored' simply because they are not responded to in site-wide announcements pushed to all your email addresses that you'd probably still ignore.

GTV functionality needed to be in BEFORE the game went live. At this point, it doesn't matter.

Look, I agree with the most of your post, but you misunderstood me.

What I meant with priorities was, that they SHOULD first make the game functional and only after that when it works to some degree and is playable, they should move on adjusting the gameplay.Im not against changes,Im open to changes aswell, but now when I remember how it was just a couple of months ago, before those permium/pro accounts...tdm for example didnt even have any maps for a decent rotation and same with duel.They had to spend 2 years to bring us maps we played for over a decade.Just until now game started evolving on other levels beside duel.Its getting slowly to the point where it has to be, but did they really had to spend all this time until now!?!?!?Ask yourself honestly how much time it would take for a group of enthusiasts to give us these features we are still waiting for.

and as for gtv/mvd, I really hope they dont fuck it up and implement serverside recordings aswell...for the sake of cheating cunts

hey, I'm not saying id is doing a superb job right now. I honestly doubt they would even say so themselves. I just picked your post for argueing why you won't see a direct response from id regarding gillz' scoreboard or something like that. Becuase it might turn out to be suicidal for them.


About the maps, again yes, they could have done a better job. But I also think that part of why a group can be a lot faster at giving known maps, is that they often don't give a fuck about copyright infringements. id doesn't have that luxury. So, at the very least it is difficult to blame them for bringing in a map like hub so late ...


But again, I wasn't here to defend id, just to give my thoughts about the lack of reaction to public criticism and also requests.

But whats the focus group for, if not giving some pointers and opinion?With making a focus group you intentionally wanna peal-off those raging piece of crap comments that dont contribute anything to the game...

And with 3rd party development I wasnt thinking only about maps.Theres this "new" netcode they did which is fucking terrible, you have to admit that.Times when people at q2 could play with 100-120 ping and owning while doing it are gone.What theire trying to do is a perpetum-mobille, they wanna make that lag disappear while it obvious to every idiot, that its impossible.What they achieved is that you dont have any feel for a projectile impact..and so on theres too many faults they did to even remember them all.

And as for maps,I understand that making a GOOD new map thats acceptable for competition and fun above everything takes a lot of time and if theire lucky enough they will make 1 out of 10 maps thats worth playing.So im patient about that, no need to rush I rather see quality than quantity...

to sum it up crv didnt deserve that ban...it just shows their arrogance and egoism of certain people over there.Its shit how they treat with their fans like bitches and we continue to give them money! :(

you see the focus group is an entirely different thing.


Their role is that of advisors, not customers.

And advisor's job is to find things out and make suggestions. They are also a limited group, which the "client" (here: id) controls and wield no actual power (except for breaking the nda, of course :P). As soon as the client says they don't want more ideas, the advisors are done.

I don't think I have to elaborate on how that is different from a customer demanding that "their" games gets improved.




P.s.: Of course, the focus group people are also potential customers, but still just a fraction of that group, so turning only some of them into disgruntled customers is not nearly as bad.

/edit

as for crv deserving or not deserving, I couldn't say as I don't know all the details. I mean, considering this is the internet, it's possible he went from his first words he posted, to spamming the channel and insulting everyone.
And people generally tend to omit such things when they complain about being banned from somewhere ;)

But as I said, that's just a possibility and I don't know details, so I won't judge him, but I won't judge the op there, either.

.... get off id's cock gillz

why the fuck are you in the focus group?

[q ]You have the clueless nobodies and the same 5 people who agree with pretty much every change that occurs.[/q]
ENKULER DE RIRE

I got kicked as well, for just *asking* why it mattered that one of the major patchlist leaks was talked about on a QL stream, when it was already leaked on ESR. Didn't even have time to ask why it's not okay for an anonymous to leak stuff, but it's okay for Noctis to routinely talk about focus stuff all over irc. It's a joke of a channel anyway for all of the reasons posted by ralph. Groupthink morons will jump all over you if you dare have any criticism about anything id are doing with QL.

u need verbal one man army!
on my way!

damn god , thx vor_

What I REALLY wanna know is, why am I not in my own QuakeLive group? Somebody invite me. I admit, I'm happy with QL so far, as every single one of my requests has been met, short of GTV. But I still think I should be in the focus group. 'cause duh.

They can't do that, you might hear about the surprise lan party for your birthd.....

nvm

hrmph
=P

so bad i had to plus

Optical illusion

pray someone can mod doom 4 into a good multiplayer game; ql is already fucked :(

have you tried miltia

haha

So it can still be funny if used correctly. :D

cool to see irc still being used, thought it is now something outdated from the past

is there any alternative for chat rooms anyway ?

letz do our own elite channel!

Apparently, it's how hackers talk when don't want to be overheard.

omg thanks for sharing. This is so awesome, I almost cried.

Fantastic. They say it with straight faces too!

aw
maw
gawd

Ahhh yeah.....what´s the catch with the boats? Are we boats? Or are we the sea? wtffffff.

*edit* Luckily someone made the effort to explain accurately, what´s wrong with that numb3rs video. *phew*

Hahaha, Gillz is so fucking stupid its fantastic.

I have no braen and i must derp.