I was just about to post this. why you always gotta steal da +?

he works at id bro...

Buy one shitty console game to access beta of another shitty console game.

Thanks Bethesda, maker of good gamer games.

to link preorder sale with beta acess is silly marketing, but - other publishers did that also.

"When we're ready to talk about the Doom 4 id is making, we will let folks know."

Doom 3 was so disappointing, expectation wise, and with all the stuff that's been going on lately with Bethesda/id, I'm not pre-ordering DICK until I've learned more...

At least a lot more than just a "Doom 4" franchise name drop.

the singleplayer part of wolfenstein 2009 from raven was good. and machinegames wants to top this.

i think machinegames is the right studio for the title, with ex-starbreeze guys.

I like doom 3. Like it enough to play through it once a year.
Only part i didn't like was when you come into those guys with the snake like whip arms.
Those parts were repetitive.

Right but now go play doom 1 and 2 and see what the real deal is. I mean, Serious Sam was more doom than doom 3 :/

>Right but now go play doom 1 and 2 and see what the real deal is.

i would underline this.

the thing is classic doom contained many styles. today they have names.

exploration, backtracking, puzzles, tube dungeons, story driven maps, coffee break maps, arena style (big fight places), slaughterfest (monster hordes), speedrunning, traps, vertical gameplay (even so doom original couldnt shown room-over-room).

if i go deeper with this, the question is, what is the definition of doom. its a mix of many elements. i come to the conclusion id did experiment with so much stuff.

bigger websites say serious sam-style (arena, slaughterfest) with games like painkiller, ss3, hard reset, shadow warrior reboot are socalled "oldschool fps". i would say these newer games - which i like - have only a fragment of what classic doom is. the term oldschool fps isnt precise for them. only to contrast them from "newschool fps" cod i guess.

doom3 wanted survival atmosphere. a completly gameplay contrast to classic doom. and the gameplay/mapdesign had long changed after classic doom. i think they did horror and singlemonsters because of the engine. or they did the engine because they wanted this. hungry performance, new shadow system etc. most of the enemys in d3 dissapear if fragged. they couldnt or wouldnt do monster hordes. d3 is different kind of beast.

Both doom 3 and ressurection of evil were enjoyable in my case. And very much so. But I have my doubts about doom 4 :/

It's a modernized version of doom. I've played doom 1,2,3 and wolfenstein 3d all 6 episodes and spear of destiny.

It's hard to capture the same atmosphere/ feling that the original gave.. especially with a story driven game.
wolf and doom back story was a paragraph in the manual lol.

it's the same to me as q3 vs ql.

Excuse my french:

Modernised my balls. Doom3 has nothing of its predecessor's gameplay, except being an fps. You see more than 3 monsters together just a few times, and for the rest is you going around with a fucking flashlight killing one monster at the time which appears with subterfuges to make it look scary.

As punishment, you get a wall of text on why doom 1 and 2 are awesome.

At the core, doom has an arcade gameplay with weapons, monsters and the player balanced for a rich fast paced interaction, with loads of options for the player and great replayability value.

The shotgun of doom is probably the best weapon ever made in an fps. I still would like to kiss who decided that an imp would go down with one full shot. I rarely get such a satisfaction shooting a weapon in an fps. The pinning effect of machine-gun and chainsaw is great. These weapons are somewhat slow, in the sense you cannot really move too much when firing with them, but the pinning is a perfect balance factor. It often saves you when you are cornered by demons which would otherwise chew you fast, but it also serves well against cacodeamon and any former human, preventing them to damage you. When you're low, you want to use this to survive. Rockets are beautiful because of the enemy masses. How the corpses of minor monsters explode still owns anything I've seen in any game, including q3 gibs. Rockets can kill you fast if you mess up. The BFG is fucking ingenuous, and even if you could call it a bit overpowered, it still balances out with the fact you got shitloads of monsters everywhere.

The monsters in doom are designed so that they are dangerous but still you can own them plentifully in a very satisfactory way. Think of the basic monsters (former humans, imps, deamons, and cacodeamon) and you see they are all completely different in behaviour. They have a well defined character, and as a player you know exactly who they are, what they want, and how to beat them.The result of this design is great especially with the mass of monsters. The satisfaction when you let the monsters turn on each other and the sounds they make when they are fighting is just unique. I cannot count the number of times I joyfully listened to the scratchy sound the imps make when they turn melee, heard a demon grunting as reply, and felt awesome about it.

The maps elements are great. Water, poison and lava, with the environment suit as protection. Teleports, elevators, crushing ceilings, fast and slow doors... There's more variety there even if everything is done with few textured polygons, than anything shown in Doom3 (or modern FPS, to be fair). The exploding barrels are award worthy on their own. And another beauty: the ingenuous design of level enforced by the restriction of a 2D map. I much rather have smart design solutions in a restricted setting, than boring solutions with all sorts of freedoms. Doom maps shine for how entertaining and visually pleasing they are, yet coping with that restriction. Finding secrets is also affected by this in a positive way.

Doom 3 has almost nothing of all these things. You call it modernisation, I call it a shameful sequel which shares the name, the setting, and has a few monsters vaguely inspired to their ancestors.

Interesting post Memento, you should curse more often I guess.

Serious Sam is boring, so is the original Doom. Doom 3 was fine so was Quake 4 single player wise, if Doom3 would be anything like the original or Serious Same I'd throw it in the trash the second I would realize that.

Doom was cool when it came out, today I expect a lot more from games, especially if they focus on single player and I had that though even in 2004 when Doom 3 came out.

De gustibus non disputandum est.

I wonder what is the "more" you expect. Graphics? Cinematics? Voice acting?

Well certainly for SP I don't play on picmip 16 and GL_NEAREST, I think nobody does that, so yeah graphics, a good story, gameplay that involves something more than endless numbers of stupid AI scripted enemies jumping at you, and something to do besides shooting, something that drives me to play it, constant shooting and not much else just doesn't.

As for voice acting, yeah well adds to the atmosphere, altho I'm not as nitpicky as some guys regarding that.

Back in the day Metroid Prime series was a great SP experience, nowdays Bioshock1/2 were pretty good, Infinite has a passable story, but the FPS part was shit, and Darksouls was awesome. So yeah I expect something from a game that says it offers me single player experience. Doom 3 did that, so did Quake 4, I was able to play through them, in most games that are shit I can't do it, like the new Thief for example, just get bored to death, with rinse - repeat game play.

You can abstract a game to three kinds of elements:

- formal elements (logic, rules, mechanics, core gameplay, etc.)
- dramatic elements (setting, story, characters, etc.)
- technical elements (engine, graphics, sound effects, etc.)

As technology gets more powerful, game developers have more cards they can play.

Technical elements are the most affected, for obvious reasons. Dramatic elements are also affected, as the more advanced engine features may help portraying better the story and the atmosphere. I say "may" as there has been fantastic themes and atmospheres when graphics was still VGA 256 colors.

Formal elements are the least affected. The only area where things have drastically changed is physics based games, and to some extent AI. But in reality, the core gameplay is the area where comparing games 20 years apart is the fairest.

In my previous post I gave the explanation of why - at the formal level - I think Doom3 is inferior to its predecessors. I should add to that, I personally value formal elements more than the rest.

Wow. such retard. wery smurt. wow

Serious Sam first and second encounter were among the very best coop games, until few years ago now that trend kind of revived.

Doom3 was incredibly boring, repetitive and, most importantly, a different genre altogether than the previous versions. If anything the Serious Sam series represents doom a lot more than doom3.

Quake4's SP was mediocre for the time, nowadays not recommendable since now there's lots of great FPS SP games.

I'd agree on that some doom1 and doom2 parts were kind of boring, but as a game in general it remains to be one of the most entertaining out there. Makes me wonder how map quality decreased so much when comparing the early id days (until 1999) with today (2004 to 2013); it's like all the talent left the studio or are in different positions.

I liked Doom 3 + the expansion quite a bit more than I did Half-Life 2 to be honest, and I enjoyed Quake 4 sp even more, not to say they were the best sp games, far from it, but they were good for me at that point in time.

Now there's a lot of better sp FPS games like you said, so that's why I say, getting a Doom 4 that plays like Doom wouldn't cut it for me, especially if they would demand 50EUR for it.

Multiplayer wise sure, but the SP needs substance not just a corridor crawler with 200 monsters running at you when you turn a corner.

Painkiller was the true doom 2 son

AMAZING TRAILER!!

looks insane

I want Doom 4 beta but not Wolf... for my Xbone!

but is a chainsaw really an appliance though?

The trailer looked funny, but what little they showed of the gameplay in there clearly looked like a standard 60 FOV, on-rails, previous-gen console shooter.

This whole Wolf+Doom thing looks like the desparate attempt of a dying company to cash in one last time on their biggest IPs. Not getting my hopes up.

if you have established ip's. you do it because people wants it. nothing wrong with new wolfenstein/doom interpretations.

It's for the NEW consoles, so we can all benefit from the x86 PC architecture :)

even the linux & freeBSD guys, should be easier to do a installer ...

The horrible old ones (x86) from idtech3 & 4 are out of date, modern are x86-64bit like ioquake3's

looks like titanfall really got under id's skin

giff fallout 4, not this crap

what does TNO stand for?

The New Order

So can you just tell us if doom 4 is going to have deathmatch style MP? Please?

No. :D

Any news about QL 2.0?

already out

After the last Doom and Wolf flops zero chance of me pre ordering these.

for some reason blowjob blaskowitz's new advanture has been disabled in hungary (probably in other countries too), so heres an other one.

by the way it looks outdated...or is it just me?

Germany works, has it's own channel ...

https://www.youtube.com/user/BethesdaSoftworksDE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zI_gNriLXxg&hd=1

http://www.gametrailers.com/videos/aqou1a/wol...om-trailer

for you

eng - deu Trailer ?

have not seen both ... :D

it makes sense in a way. a) germans want german language, i read once its the third biggest game market in the world. b) in the older trailers they needed to cutted out all the swastikas.

set sys_lang "english"

i'll get the US/GB version !

look outdated? looks like idtech5 to me.

This game is doomed

I would hope so!

olo, the new wolfenstein ? arent there already few gameplay vids on the net ? i thought doom 4 trailer, that wud be new.

Steam pre-order page up soon I hope?

As a fan of RTCW... Wolfenstein 2009 edition was pain, I don't know If I'll be bothered to pick the 2014 edition up. :(

singleplayer wasnt bad

It also wasn't good because I remember not finishing the game.

fight on the zeppelin, boss fights, veil (bioshock forces influence).

I didn't even get to a Zeppelin..

i know, was joking, its at the end :>

you did not finish your Doom3 coop stream ether ...

I didn't have any background info on the gameplay, and I was expecting classic style fps, where levels follow each other, etc., but I was surprised with rpg elements and open'ish world (which where hype elements in games at the moment), which was a let down for me. I wasn't feeling any of that. Some of the ingame events were too over-the-top, even for a wolfenstein game.
RTCW was so good -- the atmosphere, gameplay, levels... it is difficult to top that.

>rpg elements and open'ish world

yep it felt a bit forced,. i didnt say the game was perfect. my critic was too much Dialog. i didnt like at first the evertime soldier spawning in the city streets, there was a mod to stop that, but it grow on me to fight them again. rtcw cant be remade, that ship is sailed a long time.

Soldier spawning in the city pissed me off big time, I remember that, haha.

meh

ande, cool that you list a few website sources. i like that.

Thanks, it's my pet peeve with modern journalism, everyone copies of each other and no one ever tells where they got the info.

It's a complete rewrite with data from other websites :)

i use a rss feedreader for news. eurogamer has long and detailed news. bluesnews is sometimes interesting because people email them stuff, i did it a few times.

all gaming sites copying from each other. but im not sure how much. because they have something we dont have, a kind of system to get press releases.

big german gaming newssites are awfull because they never link outside or give the source. i cant work with that.

OMFG!!!!!!!

Hans?

solo

arp

The game has been in development for 6 year.....insta flashback to Quake 4 release \o/

cool trailer, campaign of last wolfenstein game was also nice

Preordering games? If you think that's good idea I have a bridge to sell you.

Wolfenstein looks like many other games. I hope they will do better with Doom4.

I will do it! for that Chainsaw scene

A way to sell a game that'll probably flop without a little bit of enticement.

Too little gameplay material for any serious comments, weapon animations and explosions looked great tho. Wolfestein is a good ip to cover a different fps market than doom/quake.

if anyone else wondered about the song, looks like they made their own remix out of this song:




Original ver.

those trailers look so climatic, but i don't have any expectations bout the games itselves tho

Doom 4 closed beta will be available with a pre-order of another one of id id software upcoming titles, Wolfenstein: The New Order

I wouldn't call it an id software title. They did the engine and probably helped a bit to adapt it but I don't think it went beyond that.

Anyway, they made yet another good trailer but that doesn't tell much about the game itself.

This one is by "Machinegames" If Id Software help develop the title, it would of had the id logo on the front of the cover just like they did with RtCW and Wolfenstein.

to be precise, it is an id game in the broadest sense because the wolfenstein ip is from id.

It isn't. Even if they made Wolf 3D.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_Wolfenstein
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beyond_Castle_Wolfenstein

willits said id bought the ip or it was free. he wasnt sure because he wasnt there at the time.

to be fair, wolf3d hasnt much to do with the older games.

It was public domain. Also,

http://www.publicdomainsherpa.com/10-misconce....html#five

nice to know.
and we can always ask romero, he knows every detail.

It's in Masters of Doom. iirc the original company never renewed the trademark so id grabbed it

Wonder what they plan to test in the beta. Probably multiplayer. I can't remember the last time I played a singleplayer beta if ever

thats what i thought. some websites wrote multiplayer but there is not an official indication for that.

but then again.. why would you need console player beta testers to test your MP?

inb4 laged streaming textures rendering AND 60fps locked.

Both for this Wolfenstein which will ofc be a shity console port and Doom 4.

I think I've lost faith in ID permanently.

I've realised this only now, when I felt 0 excitement when reading this article about a doom 4 beta.

You got it buddy. The id software we loved disappeared years ago.

ye I was pretty much the same. Normally, even if you say "I don't care", to some degree you still do.
But after reading doom4 beta, my only reaction was "so what".

ending <3

Forget about Doom and Wolfenstein as MP games. We have Quake Live, its never going to top that. No modern game will be as smooth running at 250fps with physics, guns, arenas and modes we all love.

These are going to be SP games with possibly MP as a fun, non serious, unbalanced, frag fest for those who are not interested in playing competitively, but just want to blow up their mates.

Will play the single player for sure! <3

Way to put a price tag on beta testing.

I need to know if i have to go though alot of smooth jazz before i can shoot nazis in the face. Only reason Rage failed for me was because of the stupid vehicle timewaste travel. If you don't do openworld correct, it just becomes a chore and a filler from mission to mission. If they kept some inventory or sandbox i wont be playing it, if its corridor with a few cutscenes to progress the story, ill definitely will play it. I like my fps sp games to have a certain pace, and corridor shooters done right(no quicktime, and no infinite enemies for starters), is often those i return to replay.

Surely someone from the dev team is aware of esreality. If they were, they'd realize that basically no one wants to see another 'open world' or 'horror in the dark'/'survival' game made by id software.
All people want is a hack n' slash dungeon crawler with shotguns. ( of course, with the exploration element of the original doom in there as well. ) The wheel of id games is not going to get any rounder, especially if they keep manufacturing square wheels. The simplest solution remains the best.

Sadly I don't think Esreality is the target audience for D4.

it shouldn't be the target audience for anything

Hi bst.

No pre order for Canada?

amazon.com

retailer list wouldn't even load for US on the wolf site. checked amazon.com (since amazon.ge was listed) and saw it there

imo this new Wolf SP looks fun.

ya, I like story based sp. we'll see how this one is.

if only they wouldnt have stopped caring about gameplay at some point. when i see the few first-person scenes in these trailers it looks exactly like all their recent failures all over again D:

Wolfenstein and not a single swastika in the trailer(game?), so stupid, so spineless.

They removed the previous wolfenstein game from the german market because it still contained one or two uncensored swastikas. Guess they made sure this time and didn't use any at all.

I hope there will be a version with swastikas!!! Otherwise...it doesn't feel right, somehow...

well the nazi symbol is the swastika atleast last time i checked. so its an enemy without its symbol = one could think its an enemy without its soul of character

there was more stuff in the wolfenstein 2009 german version which was cutted out. more symbols. old music. pics on the wall from generals and nazi leaders.

look at the comparison pics
http://www.schnittberichte.com/schnittbericht.php?ID=5982811

yeah. its a shame when a game has to be gutted becaus it cant display some of its content. but then again its a touchy subject. :)

inb4 doomlive

"the very high expectations everyone has for this game" Lmao..

They have to say something, lets agree id hyping levels hasnt been the same since Todd departure, for the better.

is DOOM4 still MP focused? can't remember when or where but I remember them announcing it was going to be MP focused. Is this still true? I believe ttimo was working on it but he's gone now.

Well i dont remember that and i doubt it since doom games were never MP focused. But i guess if they make a proper coop mode for doom 4 campaign it can only be a success.

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/306884/d...h-carmack/

Sounds like a very bad news then, Rage quality in terms of multiplayer. Must be a joke. :(

well who knows now, considering carmack isn't even there anymore.

lets hope for something playable at qcon :>

No hopes about idsoftware's mainstream games now. Rage was such an extremly bad game i paid 50 euros and played literaly 30 mn.

The people that were making the success of idsoftware (Q1/2/3, Doom1/2/3) are all gone. What's left of the compagny we liked is just the name i guess.

edit: carmack said about id that they were targeting console games since Rage so what can you hope from id? :(

all the more reason to just leave it as an after thought. it's just depressing to get excited about new games. shootmania, UT3, rise of the triad, cs:go, it's just not the same. even the announced games will remain small niches like reborn and w/e else comes out.

nostalgia kills

idtech5 or whatever the hell they're using now for doom seems years behind the battlefield/crysis like game engines, or even the new UE4. game's prolly not gonna be great.

what, you don't like textures that look like plastic?

who cares about graphics on a technical level?
if the game is fun, has interesting aesthetics and atmosphere, that shit is irrelevant.

glorified technological demos got id in trouble in the first place.

its not irrelevant at all. That is how you push technology forward, by making a high end game that people with great pc's will buy, which will then create competition among the pc hardware market. Everyone here is stuck in the quake mentality that graphics dont matter and it's all about the gameplay. Actually, Crysis/BF4 had relatively OK gameplay and incredible graphics, but I stuck to it cause of the graphics, because that shit does matter. Everyone is appearance related to some extent. You can't say it doesn't matter at all. when I watch quakelive frag movies, I wonder how great it would be if you could actually stream or play quake looking like that. Either way, Doom can't look like a 2008 game in 2014 or even 2015 or 2016... whenever they plan to release it.

i could tell you how hard Quake4 and UT3 bombed (because people could barely run them at launch) and how something like Antichamber or Super Meat Boy had great success.

even disregarding that, unless you have a huge leap in technology (not possible anymore due to consoles and slowdown in hardware advances), graphics won't help you if the game isn't fun/creative/appealing.

It depends on the objective and on the franchise. A main doom release cannot have lackluster graphics. Well not that anyone still cares about it anymore.

a main doom release needs to be doom first (unlike d3), then worry about graphics.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Machine_Games

the only thing i don't like are the robots & robodog :)

to bad their CEO is a Jerk.

much excitement

At least Doom 3 had on his part that his visual style was original and his engine was powerful for the times.
With this engine, very good but not great, it won't have that advantage anymore.
And regarding originality, seems that the trend is to copy paste other game's working aspects.

Well luckily for me, Enemy Territory servers are still all over, and a new Return to Castle Wolfestein styled team shooter will be out to play soon.

from an outside view enemy territory seems almost dead. wasnt there a time when crossfire tried to feature cod4 because et got so tiny?

>a new Return to Castle Wolfestein styled team shooter will be out to play soon

whats the name of it. i thought the rtcw/et scene learned that a revive cant be done. dont missunderstand me, rtcw/et is cool, i often watched rtcw clanbase nationcup etc.

Well there are still loads of active Enemy Territory servers, even if you just want to chill out and play. some 3v3 games are up as well as 4v4/5v5. Just gotta look up tbh.

http://extraction.nexon.net/ is the name, obviously not like ww2 style but it's more modern with the same concepts in place.

trailer doesnt look convincing imho.,
lets wait for actual gameplay vids ...
if Doom 4 is anything like Doom 3 u can forget about that title too ...
dont think the game will be released too long after the actual beta is out ... you can probably also get hacks of the beta to play ...
putting some stupid trailer, that shows nothing of the gameplay, and making you buy the pig in the poke for beta access is pretty shameful

they dont do doom3 a second time. id will use the new engine features (daylight, open places, vehicles). engine/gameplay will both influcence each other. carmack/id had a plan for the engine, and we didnt saw it all in rage.

nobody noticed the never before shown gameplay on the fighter jet?

trailer looked awful to me. the more real they try and make peoples look, the more i notice how much they failed to do so. because no matter how hard they try, it never look right. may as well watch a film if i'm going to play something like that, a film with a good storyline. cutscenes, lol.

they must do what they can to appeal to the masses and make monies, but i don't want to play the gaming equivalent of skrillex and megatron having late night mars bar parties and soggy biscuit contest.

cgi is unwell
poor cgi

I would presume those "cutscenes" were made with in-game engine graphics...

well whatever they are i don't like them and they make games look tacky i think.

The degeneration of id software was of classic procedure:
Age

Cant' wait!

hopefully they'll have fixed input on controller(yes pc master race, my pc sucks for new games) rage inpug with logarithmic accel was so bad i wanted to throw the controller through the tv :/

edit: anyone know if doom 3 bfg used the same logarithmic accel on xbox as rage?