this isn't going to help you make friends.

Rage much?

Yes, and I believe its a perfectly valid excuse for it.

Maybe a little yes. I dont know where you are playing from but i dont see alot of warpers so its not worth the rage..

But on the other hand i am a casual gamer i dont care to much, but i can understand a warping enemy can ruin youre day.

This is why you play a couple of frags warmup before you ready up.
Just like a girl or a sweater, you try before you buy.

You try girls before you buy them?

It's 2013, are we not allowed to refer to women as mere property anymore?

Of course we are. I was just wondering how you to get a free sample before you buy yours?

Also, please take this seriously!

totally valid point.

warpers should be banned from ql. ppl, its XXI centaury, time to throw away modem.

Well, bad routing makes people warp too. We can't do much about the routing, man!

they can go and play on their national server.

or just fucking change inet provider.

Changing isp is easier said than done. Also, Denmark doesn't have any servers. Closest is .se or .de, and both are badly routed for a lot of people in Denmark. :/

thats horrible. i almost pity you.

still - ban all warpers.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Pay for their connections then.

Or bring in some 30 year olds. We dont need any more people leaving.

i prefer a 1000 ppl community whom i will enjoy to play, instead of 1 million of warpers.

That 1 million (of warpers) includes 1000 people not warping. You can befriend them and play on private servers, while the community is still active on the other side and this way, support, streams, etc. staying in existence.

1000 is enough to keep game running.

also: fuck all warpers, and all who defend them

"1000 is enough to keep game running"

In Dreamworld, maybe. :>

look qw

I play it from time to time.

I remember the last time we played aCtion and nightops was trying to warp their way to victory. long story short: they lost, nightops ragequit. the moral of the story is that cheating doesn't pay off.

When was that? Last time I remember l0w playing aCt, dash warped, they won and you ragequit EC in group stage.

http://www.twitch.tv/leveluptv/b/446248742?t=42m

edit: but yeah, you help prove my point. aCtion will always try to gain an unfair advantage but last time we sucked it up and shut them down.

You got your facts wrong.

Really dont hope youre serious about acusing me for warping on purpose. My connection used to be fine, but all of a sudden its shit in primetime, I've tryed several other isp's and nothing works.

And youre implying its an advantage for me to warp? Its not like i dont feel it my self with ½ sec freeze every 5 sec and 7 players jittering on my screen.

Anyway, i've ordered a fiber connection wich is coming to my area in start 2014, so hopefully the warp will end there.

You're pretty awesome at putting words together but it doesn't mean shit. So on behalf of the whole quake community I am going to ask you to stay away till then, thanks in advance. But knowing you guys you will probably end up scouring the whole ql scene, looking for more warpers.

You can read my story below about warping. Luckily I'm not like you, I don't feel the need to lower the quality of peoples online gaming experience. Instead I stepped down and dealed with my problem. Maybe you could learn a thing or two from that.

I'm not sure why you're so obsessed to fuck with people. But you do enjoy molesting infant children so I guess it all adds up.

Ok, youre obviously not a person to whom you can talk reasonable stuff, so im just gonna leave it. Take care.

So you are in fact leaving? great! See you in 2014! I'm concerned you will still be warping though.

Don't rage much man! : ) Warping is more of a disadvantage for the warper. It's pity that u pull this as a reason when you loose. Anyway I just laugh on ragequitters. :)) And still, in most cases it's not something you can easily change, there is still no cmd in QL for changing your routing and ISP, so u better just deal with it!

Doesn't seem very nice to laugh at your teammate now does it? :)) No wonder you warp considering your comprehension of networking and ISPs. But I guess stupid people will just keep doing stupid shit. trippy used to cheat and he's not the brightest of the bunch.

edit: you guys sure have big egos. bringing up how disadvantageous it is for you to warp. that means you think you'd be the best player ever if it wasn't for the warp. the sad part is you would probably be worse because you wouldn't be dodging like you do today :))

I don't warp anymore, since I changed my provider. Didn't know that, this game could be this smooth. : ) I feel sorry for the warpers! : (

Maybe you could spread the word about getting out of warp hell? A lot of people don't seem to know how to.

just play the other warpers and everyone will be happy!!!

So much butthurt in one post.

well i play on a laptop and i warp..
doesnt matter if i play wireless or with cable, i just warp every now and then..

i got some advice that i should check if my system updates all kinds of crap.. could be windows8 just being shit..
i don't know if there are other ppl who have experience with the QL + Win8 combo?

anyways, if i keep warping, so be it.. won't make me stop playing =)

You should be hanged.

Awww, you're so sweet!

Nah I'm serious. You shouldn't play until you fix it. Its unfair for other players.

so i should stop playing something i enjoy because others can't handle the fact i warp every now and then? please...

I recently had some bad warp and had people complain. I stopped playing and resolved the issue because I'm not a massive dickbag (I am though, but not when it comes to warping)

well if only i knew how to resolve it i would.. (thats why i asked the question about others with QL + Win8 experience)
HOWEVER, if it turns out to be my provider i wont resolve it.

Im not going to switch internetprovider, resulting in breaking my contract and receiving a fine, to please some internetplayers i do not know.

if that makes me a massive dickbag, so be it...

win8 is fine. think of something else.

you should also break the contract to please yourself (not randoms!) with a better service and in return will result in a much better gaming experience as well.

my gaming experience is fine dude =)
i hardly notice my warp/pl...

that is excellent for you. same goes for people cheating using wallhacks and/or aimbots. it's not very inconvenient for the one using them but instead their opponents suffer. but that's totally fair, right?

this is the thing, some really bad warpers who hardly notice it have a massive advantage, its actually impossible to hit them and they can hit you fine. its not really a problem if they can feel the warp and it hinders them as well, but even so, they're a different target than anyone else. its just like cheating imo, wish there was a way that ql could fix this shit.

my reply was regarding my own gaming experience.

Regarding my warping:
The problem is that people start crying if they miss only 1 rocket due to someone warping for less than 1 second once every 1 or 2 minutes. that's just sad..

If i was warping non stop i wouldn't be playing, cause i do want to hit something myself..

Edit: comparing warping to cheating is just silly.. cause im sure you've played some games where you completely destroyed opponents (casual tdm or ca). but i guess playing on public servers against lesser players when ur on a stable connection is fun for them...

missing a crucial shot only every 1 minute? yeah no big deal. lols

clanarena... didnt know ppl took that so serious..
or does me playing ca only change things? =)

oh and my warps are gone... dont ask me how.. maybe my laptop was pulling a lot of updates, dno =)

Don't think id will do anything about warpers as they are too busy banning all the zoom abusers now.

fth is a zoom abuser, you got me curious.

Don't hate the player, hate the game.

It is possible to remove warping from the game, but at the cost of making the game absolutely unplayable for the warpers. They wouldn't be able to even move properly. Stuff like failing jumps, walking into lava etc.

I'm all in favor of this of course - it's _their_ problem that only _they_ can fix, so it's only right if they're the ones to suffer, not people who can't do anything about it.

Unfortunately for us - this can never become default for public servers (noobs don't know you shouldn't upload movies while you play) and it's a kind of change that can't be implemented as an option.

I apparently warp from time to time and get accused of doing it on purpose. Tho my provider doesn't give a shit and so do I because I won't bother switching providers just because someone is moaning on the internet for fairness (lol). More expensive and less bandwith (40mbit to 4mbit and 10 bucks more). Totally worth it!
Game feels shit anyway lately. I hit the most ridiculous rails/lg behind the walls and yet can't get a proper log on when I'm on the model. Rockets are also meh and that with 30ms ...

Funny thing is people still hit 40lg on me and yet they QQ like there is no tomorrow )). Maybe it wasn't the warp that you lost by more than 10 frags.
Btw. you can check in warmup if someone warps. If you don't it is entirely your fault.
Tho it is understandable that in competitive games it must be frustrating.

dont justify your cheating to gain elo, you cunt ! :D

I don't gain elo I am gifting it to almost everyone atm. Haven't played that worse in a long time. Maybe less dota and more ql would help. Albeit I don't enjoy quake that much anymore. Feels like Im playing on 60ms ((

dota? lost respect to you :b

I thought you never had any for me when I whip out the rail :D

it kinda dodges for you

the comment kinda harvests plusses for you


repeat for infinity -> god of the supreme rulers

plusses are the only reason I post comments at all.

That's a paradox

PLUSSES ARE POTAT

and he who controls the potat, controls the universe

Wish I could warp IRL, I could do all kinds of crazy shit like warp off of tall buildings, dodge incoming traffic, shoplift with ease, stab someone in the neck and warp away pretending it wasn't me. I believe that researching warping technology would pave the way towards a better future for mankind.

yea eburb!

WOOP WOOP

dird stupid warper

Ban warpers they are killing quake im serious . Let them play only in theyre own country at least

I won't lie. I get super fucking pissed at warpers... you look like a fucking idiot when you try to kill them and you can't hit them... I have been in situation in CA where it's like, 3 teammates vs 1 warper and we're all sitting there unloading shotgun/LG/Rockets and not hitting a fucking thing. The demos are hilarious... super warping trolls...

Yeah so I think there *is* a way to purposely do the warp thing. Cripple your upstream, but leave your downstream alone.

Could somebody with some network whatever, knowledge, experience do the science thing and pupblish an ESR paper on it?

No wait! I just thought about it some seconds more... so don't publish the findings just yet, unless there is a way to detect or prevent. Else that woulde be the equivalent of releasing aimbot for free to all noobs.

It could force id to fix the issue if that was found to be an effective means of gaining an advantage.

well, afaik ''warp effect'' happens when client doesn't send all needed packets to the server. So server can't show someones model smoothly as he doesn't know where is model should be all the time. Yes, some engines can interpolate/extrapolate players' models movement, but i'm not sure if they can smooth ''hitbox'' position, as it could make a lot of errors and more unpredictable glitches then just ''warp''.

There can a few reasons of warping:
- bad routing to the server, so in result not all client packets reach the server, some of them get lost or come too late.
- too low uploading speed: it can be limited by ISP, or upload channel is used by some application on client PC (torrents, antiviruses, etc)
- client's PC has unstable or broken network hardware, which causes loosing of some sended packets.
- client has lowered value of ql packets by some cvar like cl_maxpackets. But i can be wrong here, as i'm not that active quaker.

There is only one player position on the server. There's no separate position of imaginary "hitbox". It's where the player is and clients draw models in the same spot (please don't start discussions about model animations leaning outside of the hit zone - that has nothing to do with this thread).

From the client, server gets information about buttons pressed (like +forward and +moveleft and +moveup) and direction you're looking at. It can extrapolate just fine how you will move even if you don't send any packets to the server.

Currently it doesn't - it waits for your packets before it even attempts moving your model, and when it finally does, it kind of replays all that you've done client-side, moving you half the room at a time. That's warping.



If the server extrapolated movement (without waiting for the client to send updates), there would be no warping at all.

However, that means that a warper that released +forward will keep going ahead, sometimes walking into lava, falling into void, whatever.

That also means a warper won't be able to perform a b2r because both circle jumping and strafe jumping require moving the mouse.

In such a systems, on warper's screen, you'll get severe "rubber-banding". That's when client predicts you running fast and being somewhere, but the server's extrapolation often puts you on lower speed, so you're pulled back a bit few times a second.


But again: that would move responsibility for YOUR link into YOUR hand, or it's YOU who has to suffer. This is fair play at higher levels of play and would make sense as a server spawning option, if that was even possible to implement.

PS. AfterShock implemented anti-warping by extrapolation, but the way they did it is:

- the server extrapolates movement when there's no updates from client (in this situation, player stops in place in QL)

- when the update finally arrives, server replays everything from the last update and corrects player's position on server to his position.


This has obvious advantages:

1. People that warp don't get any rubber-banding effect, they see the game as rather smooth (for them it looks much like warping in QL, no problem at all until you receive knockback).

2. It makes warping when running around less apparent for the other players and helps them aim at you when you move somewhere and they shoot you from the side (like railing from RG to MH on ztn).


However, a new problem appears:

It's still the server being "corrected" by the client about player's position, not the other way around. So there still is warping.

The warping that remains is basically invisible in noob games (when no one strafe jumps, just walks in straight lines). it's also less apparent when people strafe jump (the warps are microscopic there), except maybe some extreme cases (like server thinking you failed b2r and then warping you back up - that's theoretically possible in AS). Normally it should help a bunch.

However there will be actually BIGGER warping when people dodge. That's because you will see someone going to the left when he already switched to moving right on his screen. So instead of warping around some smaller area, you will see him walking sideways, but warping on bigger distances. I think it's possible to learn dodging in such a way that you win all shaft battles.

I'd still like to see this tested in QL to see how bad it is with skilled players. Hard to test on AS as you can imagine :)

"If the server extrapolated movement (without waiting for the client to send updates), there would be no warping at all."

I don't think extrapolated movement could prevent all warping situations, cause extrapolation can't work endlessly without receiving newer packets. But at least it can make them less noticeable. As you sad the results of those endless extrapolation could be very unpredictable, so usually such technique has some windows where it works and where it doesn't.

OK, let's not call this extrapolation (which is predicting stuff that probably will happen but you're not sure if it will). Negative timenudge is extrapolation. What we're talking about here is just the server doing its job - moving players around and sending their position to everyone.

Yes, it can work endlessly. If it thinks you still have a movement key pressed, it will move you forever, what's the problem with that?

And what warping situations might there be, then? Answer: only for the client who will warp on his screen, but nothing will warp on ours.


EDIT: in AfterShock's system (explained above), there might be a limit, because the server will not only move the player entity, but also remember what player's last umm... "confirmed" state was. Upon receiving an update, it moves player back and re-applies movement. There may be some limit of how much the client can lag behind in such situation (just like in warpy Q3/QL) that would disappear completely in case of a system that doesn't remember anything and just keeps going.