Why no thread discussion? :(

because nobody could be arsed to write one it seems, thanks for just doing it yourself

Because we are mad with the seedings, stermy and tox out, while xron qualified by winning vs Luminus and Brejk.

Tox played shit. Im more sad about vo0

You are forgetting the part where tox was unable to overlock his usb 1.1a and had to play handicaped.

With 125hz is unplayable..

He didnt play with 125hz WMO, he used other mouse

VODs of European DUEL Finale at the bottom of the following page (missing Cooller - evil) :

http://www.esportactu.fr/competition/4649-qua...finale-eu/

VODs of European SACRIFICE Finale at the bottom of the following page :

http://www.esportactu.fr/competition/4657-qua...finale-eu/

Much appreciated, thank you!

Stream highlight to me is of course



EU is finished by the time you post it. When are the NA games?

Well, vo0 vs Cooller still coming, no? (and yeah, I thought that someone else would open the thread )

NA duel: Today, 05 Ago. 2017 14:00 CDT

As dorky as it is, this gif contains more fun than you had during your whole life

cant wait to see his face after quakecon when the million dollar hype is over and every quake tourney thereafter having the same 3k strong audience we are used to

A lot of questionable characters have had a lot of fun in their careers. What's your point? Having fun cancels mistakes?

Hey man sorry that you dont have fun, I hope you can turn your life around!

Judging by your posts, you're projecting.

Judging by our dialogue here, you are deflecting

Deflecting what? You're the one avoiding to reply to my point when i showed you how madly flawed your "logic" is. I'm sure hitler had a lot of fun too. This makes his detractors "haters" according to you, and their points worthless. Nice logic. I see why you didn't even try to defend your statement. In your defence, i hope you were stoned to shit when you wrote, because no person with iq higher than 60 should write shit like that.

Hey man sorry for finding your soft spot, but don't worry, unless you are over 30 you can still catch up

What a spectacular disaster your life must be :-)

Still trying to save face?

Save face for what? Your chain of comments is embarassing. It's even too evident your life is a wreck and you're vomiting random stuff online as medication.

"A lot of questionable characters have had a lot of fun in their careers. What's your point? Having fun cancels mistakes? "

Thats what you answered to a (insider) joke of mine. But yes, alright, keep foaming, little bull

"I didn't say a retarded thing, i was only pretending"

And that's your defence? Weak.

What retarded thing did I say? I dont ecpect any answer to this btw

You hope you won't get any answer, because you've been cornered and exposed multiple times already and you're now begging for mercy.

Haha, so you cant name anything, as I predicted. You are just trying to save face because I made you mad. Keep going tho, little lab rat.

You can't name anything? You mean, like the reply to your original abomination of a comment? You either forgot about it because antidepressive meds give you the attention span of a goldfish, or, more likely, you're pretending there are no previous replies, like one couldn't simply scroll up

Name one (only one is enough) aspect of why my original comment is retarded

Protip: You won't

Not that i expect written evicìdence to actually mean anything to your retarded mind, but let's try again, shall we? Your og argument was that being happy negates the stupid shit one does. Retarded, indeed.

But go ahead, pretend ytou didn't say it or that you meant something else. I know you will.

You still dont get that the reply to Lam was both a personal attack and an insider joke to Lam and everybody who knows him (which is quite a lot of people on ESR) ?

And even if it wasnt, it wouldnt actually imply that happiness negates stupidity, at most it would imply that happiness is more important than intelligence. Anyway, I bet you can up with something smart now, since stupidity is so distasteful to you.

"And even if it wasnt, it wouldnt actually imply that happiness negates stupidity, at most it would imply that happiness is more important than intelligence."

Coincidentally, both arguments are wrong.

What about them?

Some more infos plz:

-When is the eu finishing?
-Where are the games happening eu/na?
-Can we got time of the games?
.
.
.
.-Why I am not play there?

-Look at the brackets. GarpY vs wichtL happening right now so there are only 2 games left, Tox vs Nofear and vo0 vs Cooller

-London for the EU playas and California for the americans, from what I can remember (just starded watching the stream)

-EU duel: happening right nao
NA duel: Today, 05 Ago. 2017 14:00 CDT
EU Sacrafice:Tomorrow 06 Ago. 2017 03:00 CDT
NA Sacrafice: Tomorrow 06 Ago. 2017 12:00 CDT

-Dunno man, got eliminated or didn't even try?

didn't try but still...


TY though for the info :)

Just now that I'm editing the thread I realize that Cypher dropped The Defendants lol :( (replaced with deus), anyone know the reason behind it? and are there any other big changes? (don't remember each lineup exaclty)

I'd rather cut both my balls off than watch another minute of this garpy wichtl shitfest

i'd cut your balls of too instead of watch/play quake champs

I only hope they can have some custom servers, Ranger model only with 150/150 health/armor & disable abilities so i can play some clan arena

there's quake live for that

dood quakelive clan arena is dead in NA, no real servers if you have over 1700 elo (newb servers ban you)

If you're that good then play in EU with 80 ping or so.

"that good" lol
"80 ping NA-EU" lol

Well he complains about having too much elo and the scene being dead and full of noobs.

I'm from EU and I can play on US servers with 80 ping or less on QL, so keep your lol's to yourself.

I see you're a fan of ql tutorial mod. Off you go.

Why are some at the lan and some at home?
That's quite weird isnt it?

Only people that play Sacrifice are at the lan.

Okay, thanks.

So tox plays in a team (can't remember) and could still qualify in the byoc?

Apparently Sacrifice will be played at the same time as the BYOC tournament; toxjq is out.

lol raisy outlging toxjq, gg hax

Apparently Raisy is a very good aimer, and why does everyone hold this opinion Tox is the best lg aimer ever...

strenx vs tox furious heights lan match

Said his wmo failed and got his mind uncertain of gameplan.

Wp to raisey

Don't think I ever saw it but let's not define a guy from one game.

Raphas rail vs Strenx was probably the most impressive thing ever in that Toxicity match they had many years ago.

one game? Ive been watching tox since he was playing under the shadow of his brother gopher in ice climbers. His aim is consistent with the lg. The only other players that can go toe to toe with him would be strenx and stermy and perhaps some clan arena kids but in modes that actually matter toxjq is the best.

He might be better but it's a marginal edge at best. Specs always act (especially regarding Tox) as if his aim can carry him through the meta decisions. Facts are on any given day he won't be the best aimer, and he did not play well in those games.

I never thought tox was good at duel, he gets flustered and makes horrible decisions but i think in terms of lg he would always be the best aimer.

Yeye i get your point. I just wanted to make the point Tox isn't invincible re aim like a lot of people want to think.

nah tox is only unstoppable in ctf/tdm where he can rely on his team so his nerves dont get out of control.

Some clan arena men in their 40s outaim tox in QC - the king is dead

let's not define a guy from one game

Well how about you don't do that then and watch some tox demos instead, start around 2002 and include q4. He's regarded as a top lg aimer because he's been one for 15 years.
There's no 'marginal edge' either. When he's allowed to play his game he becomes the biggest aimwhore ever, thus the tox hype train. He's a bit unstable in that regard in QC, but then again who isnt.

Yes he's a top aimer, again he's not a God and he certainly isn't a level above any other top tier aimer. I don't need to watch previous games to determine how good he is I've seen enough of QL and QC and frankly if he's being outpaced by guys who were top aimers in QL now in the beta he clearly isn't as good as you believe.

Maybe he'll prove me wrong at some point. But that's also why I've never UNDERSTOOD the Tox hype train and why I bothered to comment in the first place. He acts a bit like a robot/sociopathic but that doesn't suddenly make him a mouse mechanical whizz.

No offence to Tox he's still amazing and 1000x the player I'll ever be.

Could you please explain in what way tox is "sociopathic"?

He just gives off a really antisocial emotionless vibe in interviews. You know, traits typically associated with sociopaths. Not that I'm saying he IS one.

A sociopath is not emotionless. They can be quite hot headed. They also fake emotions well to manipulate people. Their main characteristic is a greatly diminished moral compass. I've had every impression tox is a nice guy. Maybe just a bit shy in the interviews.

I'm sure he is a nice guy

He just dropped the "sociopath" word to look cool, he doesn't actually know what it means, it seems.

You obviously never been to Sweden where people are reserved and calculated and don't like like monkeys like a lot of brits do.

Also his aim suffers because he's been messing with his sens for QC. I think he's using a completely different type of mousepad too. I recall even strenx saying he had the best LG.

I think the way Strenx aims is far more consistent tbh, but again we're splitting hairs. There's little in it either way and on the day the best guy would win (obviously Strenx =D)

So you dont understand the hype but refuse to watch previous games and yet you open your mouth ?

Tox was one of the best aimer in Q3 and his LG was the sickest, you can nitpick all you want but it is what it is

It's pretty obvious why people are excited to see him play...

He is a level above other top aimers (the only exception being cypher) and he proved that many times. Watch the demos or dont, the evidence is there regardless - thats why people cheer for him.

And socipathic? That guy mostly talks about his setup and sens, in a very calm and collected manner. I dont remember him talking about his superiority or manipulating/convincing his audience about something. He has a stable job, too.

His rockets are bad tho.

In Quake 4, Stermy had better LG than Tox. I followed that game very closely, and it was pretty fuckin' obvious. But this is just going off LG percentage, and equally stacked LG fights.

Thank fuck NA gets 12 well deserved spots, only big names in that list.

Don't worry, there's more US players to qualify from BYOC

What the fuck was that?

Well, "Nofear" lives up to his name to fucking own Toxjq like that.

And tox, wtf? was it really "all mouse"? He was doing brainless rushes and stupid moves (like walking into the acid) all the game. Caster's coment about tox being unconfortable with the enviroment also sounds like bullshit for a player that experienced.

Both, using a different mouse can get worse your confidence in general (and your aim clearly), but still he played badly in general

C

Y

P

H

E

R

A

P

H

A

N

G

I FOUND IT:=>

ITS C O O L L E R !!!

Big UP Wichtl and Raisy!

just great to welcome a pair of novel players at big game!

Jesus christ this game is bad to watch. It's like every game is the worst QL 2-1 dm13 camp and hidefest. Just add Nyx so you can run away

Compare this to something like Painkiller which, despite it's technical problems, was far more fun to casually watch

Sacrifice is actually even more entertaining to watch and play IMO.

I had more fun watching sacrifice than duel for sure. I'd like to see it played on symmetrical maps

It would remove a part of the strategy of getting first skull to choose your base and gain advantage based on what you prefer defending and/or attacking.

coollers last frag to qualify in sudden death https://clips.twitch.tv/PerfectBumblingEndiveLitty

LOL I was about to post it

Not Quake.

a piece of quake for raisy

Totally agree, brainless plasma-rushing is where Quake transcends into an art!!!

portable telefrag device, what a joke what is this UT

C O O L L E R
O
O
L
L
E
R

What a series vs Vo0!

Sad for voo, evil, stermy and tox not qualifying.

They still have the BYOC oportunity tho...

hope they'll use an option of bringing their own computers with them by plane :']

Gg Cooller, wp vo0. Great match

all about unequal pigs disadvantage ...

a fest of disappointments today and only strenx 'my heart is beating strong' happy yet :'/

leggo Xron do it for ash!

Where is ash? Any idea why he isn't playing QC?

Jail afaik

not sure, but he seems to have been involved in some internet fraud or smth

:/

Seriously, or a joke? Where is there a link on this on the internet?

anyone who watched the stream from begining to end knows what is this?

Europe regionals "runnersup" scheduled for Monday 7 August 2017 03:25 CDT

Bracket: https://play.eslgaming.com/quake/global/quake.../rankings/


Some more extra spots? (Byoc players fucked up? lol)

I saw this also, no clue what it is.

But... Evil vs Toxjq on round 2, they did it again xD

Why does everyone thinks evil is any good at QC?
From what I've seen he's really mediocre.

A lot of fucbo...I mean fanboys around here

3rd at Moscow LAN with one really close map to Cooller (doing better than Nitrino, Agent, Base...) isn't so bad.

Evil is a quake world champion, newb.

You've got a point, but he was a world champion when the quake pro scene was kinda dead.

I don't care what anycunt says. Evil beat Rapha on LAN to win 1st place at DHW2012.

100%

Sad to see people diminishing his acomplishments.

Evil has the best or one of the best aims in quake champions right now.

He's hitting harder than toxic, strenx, agent, base, cypher( but cypher isn't even in the top 5 hardest hitters of quake champions)

He just needs to hit a little harder and he'll be literally unstoppable. His style has never been about brain or control or whatever. If he can badly outaim the opponent, he wins, otherwise he loses.

Evil just needs a little time and he'll explode on the scene like he did in quake live. Where he was a nobody for years before exploding out of nowhere.

Why so many people think evil was nobody?

He was sitting in Russia and playing Russian LANs for years, he was pretty much at his normal level, often beating cooller, cypher, jibo and other top players in their best shape. His QL performance is not much different than his normal performance any time before.

But in Quake Champions he did nothing significant yet. Maybe he didn't put enough time into it, or whatever, but I think that seeding him at lower level is completely appropriate at this moment.

Because he was nobody, in q3. He won a very small numbers of regional cups. Nothing major or international.

Edit: and in quake champions it's not true that he did nothing significant yet, because nobody did anything significant, the first significant tourney will be this month. Due to the nature of the game, he just needs to hit a wee little harder and he can stomp anyone in a minute.

This is how quake champions works. Barely known names are regularly beating Rapha, Cooller and Cypher just by aiming and abusing lameness.

And evil just so happens to be already the best aimer in quake champions. That's significant.

He did not win major/international cups because he didn't participate in them. But he consistently beat top Q3 stars and world champions on LAN.

In QC he already lost several times to noobish people, so who cares if he has some aim.

He didn't partecipate in them because there was no point in doing so, he used to be steamrolled by top 15 players in quake 3. He won some match here and there, but everyone does that. You're lying when you say he consistently beat top q3 players.

Also, both Rapha and Cypher are losing to absolute nobodies in quake champions, people that couldn't have even touched them in ql are stomping all over them quite regularly. So, according to you, Rapha and Cypher are useless, right?

Evil is just an hair from destroying anyone. His aim will rise, and it's all it takes in this game.

I can't write a good answer to a comment which makes no sense.

He didn't win "matches". He won LANs. I think he won more Russian Q3 LANs than coooler and cypher combined, and in almost every one of those LANs there were players like cooller, cypher, jibo and other top stars of 200x.

I have no idea why he didn't travel to foreign tournaments, but certainly it wasn't for lack of skill.

Dude Cypher was like 15 at the time of those lans. And how many did he won, and against who, exactly? Saying "he beat cooller" doesn't mean much, any top 20 quake player can beat cooller quite regularly.

And, again, if he was really strong, and in that game he wasn't at all, he would have 100% took part in major tournaments. Like he had no probs in doing later when he actually became strong in quake live.

I guess it's in-case of drop outs which when taking visas and such into consideration are bound to be a couple.

or maybe to give away some consolation cash prizes

Topic says half of 64 will qualify. We have 12 from EU, while 16 expected, so that with 16 from NA we get 32. Maybe this bracket is about to decide the last 4.

Quakecon is planned for 32 players only, the idea was to get 12 from each region (EU+NA) through the Regionals, which makes 24 players total, the 8 spots left would be filled through qcon BYOC (with a mini tournament there on LAN or w/e, which is the goal, for example, of the aussie players that are planing to go).

So yeah, that was what I mean by extra spots and byoc players fucked up, maybe they changed their plans.

Where can we see Avek vs Cooller games????

lol winz is not amused watching DaHang play.

what happened?

Nothing really, just pointing out winz bored look while watching DaHang play his duel match next to him.

What's winz even doing there? I thought he was stuck on OW?

Raisy!!!!!!!

MVP!

a cheating nobody who'd get rekt in a real quake game such as quake live.

anonymous comments "a nobody", ok...

Well that is also what Raisy said on his stream. Qc i too noob friendly and he would have no chance in ql.

lul

That match was a mix of hilarious + ridiculous, what a shitfest. I feel sorry for Dandaking tho. :(

dooi is qualified to Quakecon. :> lul

Looking forward to seeing 10 dog shit American players qualifying tonight

Looking forward to Brits embarassing themselves in an in international context, be it sports, politics or ESR comments

Given how patriotic you come across at times as a German it must suck to be one of Europes biggest cucks.

Epic, u mad for ur bf? xd

No I prefer to rate people on their individual merits (the Americans who will qualify are all individually dogshit so that's a fair assessment)

But since you seem so fond of grouping everyone together how does it feel to be #2 on the top of the cucks list? Rising ever so fast too!

1. Im not German
2. Ur mad

I'm really not :p:

"cucks"
"cucks list"
":p:"

who's number one?

o/

I'm just kidding btw don't really believe in that shit.

But you're right =D

I thought so. That cuck thing is so childish though, if anything it means you have some of the hottest women.

Swedish women are typically very attractive, this is true.

Nah, it's a pretty strong insult. :D

if you're a 12 years old nerd maybe

I'm talking about the word, not the people who use it. :)

It's definitely not a compliment to your women.

It's pretty much the same as calling someone a fag (not in meaning, but severity).

It's too easy to counter it by saying "well for sure you're not the one to be a cuck as the women from your country are too ugly".

I don't get it. It just means your women wanna cheat on you because you're not good enough. So it insults you as inferior while saying your women aren't loyal.

In a political context referring to countries and whatnot, the meaning is just generalized out of the bedroom to mean that you enjoy watching what you're supposed to love and protect (your country) be screwed by outsiders (usually immigrants).

I still find it a stupid nerd insult that mostly only online nerds use. I've seen it dozens of times online but never heard it being used ever in real life whatever country I'm in while I've even heard the word noob used in real life lol

Yep, it gets parroted a lot, often by people who don't even get it. Better to avoid it for that reason.

cuck

I smash your face in :)

Has everything been okay lately, darling?

Witty!

=]<o~~~

We won the war. Rooted.

Which one?

BOTH OF THEM.

There were only two?

Embarrassing ourselves at sport ?
That's retarded.

Football, the biggest sport in the world. You spend a fuckton and you drop on your face every time, be it on club or national level.

oh, you mean that game which invented?

Our clubs have been successful in Europe:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Europ...g_managers

At the moment in other sports like boxing/F1/Tennis/Swimming/Cycling we are doing well atm too.

Hardly embarrassing..,

The last 5 years England is non-existant on a club level. Also, on a national level England is even cuter.

At least you agree we're not an embarrassment at sports and as a result have to use the last few years of European level football to as the basis of your argument (even so we've had clubs make it to the champions league semis 50% of the time over the last 6 years..

where's Germany in Boxing, Tennis, MMA, etc.?

Also look at this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Summer_Olympics_medal_table

Last Olympics, Britain got 67 medals including 27 gold, 23, silver, and 17 bronze, while Germany got 42 medals (17 gold, 10 silver, and 15 Bronze.)

And that's while having the biggest population in Europe (82 million vs. 65 million in the UK).

GG

Medal counting on esr. Seriously?

Did you even read the messages above?

Don't ask troll questions. Just write down what you think I have missed.

Says the guy who asked a troll question in the first place. The irony.

good doping program?
I know a bit about cycling, and I am pretty sure there is a lot of investments and state sponsored medical research behind the scenes in the uk ... the the olympics took place in the uk not that long ago, and there was also a very sudden rise in medals, that is not really so well explainable ... its just like spain, etc. ... every sport I see nowadays, I evaluate all the professionals as dopers, its not anymore as it used to be a decade ago when I really believed they reached their levels through hard training, etc ... the fascination dropped like 25 % - 33 % ... and the thing is ... the organisations managing the sport have zero interest in discovering dopers, because of the bad consequences for their sport in general ... so you just know all the people dope, they can even take test themselves to train doping and just know how to take the correct dose so they dont get caught and the sports organisations are all looking away ...

Butthurt because not a single Brit qualified? That's a shame, lul.

Not at all, I'm used to us having zero presence in quake or exports!
I just thought the American qualifiers we're unwatchably boring due to the lower standard

Like EU is any different? I find them equally boring to watch.

- That's why USA has won more Quakecon's than any other country and has won the last 2 Quakecon's?

- NA has less than half the population of Europe and they are only 2 countries?

Get your facts straight, and stop dissing the US just because you don't like the playstyle!

Stop being a dick!

Rapha and Dahang aren't representative of the general skill level in America imo and most of the people who qualified in America aren't on the level of those who qualified in the eu imo

America deffo used to be the best though when zero4 / fat dominated the scene

You don't know that as they haven't played each other.

Anyways, it's going to be interesting seeing all those online heroes(xron, clawz, agent, strenx, raisy, wichtl) in action at quakecon.

Doubt half of them would make it out of the group stage.

If they all get beat by Americans then rest assured I'll be gracious in defeat and humbly admit I was wrong :)

gbmaster is right, there's much more talent in EU than in US and a lot of the disqualified EU players including some of the brits like Garpy would bit most of the qualified NA players. We'll all know this.

You are comparing a continent to a country which is quite retarded.
And as I said before, Europe has over twice the population of the US.

Don't try to play smart, you know what I mean. Saying NA or saying US is essentially the same thing here as far as quake and quake players go. Those Canadian guys would just get raped by a lot of the eliminated EU players just as bad if not worse. There's no other talent in the rest of America.

Actually even if you gathered all the best players of the entire American continent including South America, Europe would still have a higher number of top players.

You could even say Europe vs. the rest of the world would win in terms of the number of high skilled players.

You're trying to argue something even though in your hearth you know we're right. You'll see this first hand in a few weeks at Quakecon.

It's indeed going to be interesting watching all those european online heroes come to LAN.

I think there might be a few NA players that can surprise you besides rapha and dahang. We'll see.

Gellehsak put up a pretty good fight against rapha. You shouldn't write him off just because he's canadian.

But you are so certain, be sure it don't backfire on you.

Time will tell, I'm just surprised someone would disagree there's more talent in Europe for Quake, it's a fact and even American players know that.

Now of course there have been some top US players in the past, however if you compare the talent pool in Europe it's simply larger than the rest of the world combined. I'm not saying that as biased it's simple facts that everybody here knows.

No disrespect to the American players, my comments were more meant to say it's a shame so many good EU players got disqualified because the tournament allows for the same number of selected European players as selected North American players that's all.

All I'm saying is I find most European players boring and overrated. gbmaster was the one that was so certain all the Europeans would win over the NA players.

Anyways, it's going to be interesting watching those games.

Time will tell for sure.

Cypher, Cooller, Evil, Agent, clawz, Tox etc. are boring and overrated?

Rapha is much more boring than all those guys to be honest, his style is way too safe and defensive.

Rapha is much more boring than all those guys to be honest, his style is way too safe and defensive.

Sure, whatever.

Each to their own I guess, and I recognize he's a great calculated player, very clever.

But if I gotta choose between watching him play or watch cypher or cooller etc. instead then my choice is easily made.

In my opinion when you try to see spectating also as means to improve your own tactical game and mind game by focussing on trying to understand all the decisions, timing details etc. (all the stuff you can do as well during spectating) it is the time you 'get it' how monumentally brilliant a player rapha is at times. The effectiveness, the effortlessness.

It helps me for one a good deal to have knowledgeable commentators who emphasise on the tactical side and keep the narrating or empty cheering to a minimum.

But of course I understand when you simply do not agree with a playstyle. I actually like Rapha's mouse movements a lot also, it is amazing to watch, almost perfect for spectating in my opinion. It's fast, accurate, but with least amount of big sweeping movements, or unneccessary movement in general

I totally get it. I find amazing how Rapha can stream himself playing while explaining his decisions and what's going on. I for one wouldn't be able to focus on a game and talk about what I'm doing at the same time in such a detailed level, very interesting.

The tactical aspect of his style is impressive, I just find there are a lot of players with a more aesthetic style IMO in terms of movement, aim, aggressiveness, risk taking etc.

Cooller's mouse movement is somewhat even more impressive in terms of control and movement.

truth is quake multiplayer died off in the U.S. ... and there is just no multiplayer scene thats comparable to EU ...
u only have ur saviour Rapha, but thats about it

Not trying to pile on but I think it's worth pointing that NA is geographically much larger than Europe. That means NA players play with a higher average ping. I do indeed think European players have better mechanical skills but it cuts both ways -- NA players play more regularly at higher ping and therefore have to rely more on strategy. Everything else being equal, I think NA players are as good, just don't have same level of aim as some top Euro players.

Woah, DAT rapha vs gelleshak. One of the best of the day. :)

wp gelleshak! gg rapha

https://clips.twitch.tv/ZanyDeadYogurtDansGame

Yes it was interesting for sure.

cpmers committing suicide outchea

All 17 of them? :S

US casters need to improve. It looks that some of them, they barely ever played any quake.

"US casters need to improve. It looks that some of them, they barely ever played any quake. " Edited by mala at 03:28 CEST, 6 August 2017

Makaveli and Jehar are alright tho.

ironic saying that about NA casters, while we have the condiment duo here at europe for the most part

lol :D

the condiment duo is awesome, no joke

US casters were miles better

twitch chat after rapha loses first map (and right before he wins the next 2 and qualifies)

Kanivakil : this game is different than quake live; rapha can't dominate.
visachan : ow player rekt Kreygasm
mousestar1 : rapha reign is over
BigBowbooski : Rapha = All show and no go
backstablink : rapha is old now
xpoizone : Rapha first loss
noobelor : why so shocked people
buck5thescot : lol rapha is gona lose
samm10101 : NO LUCIO ULT LUL
Tr1pwire_ : told you all. cpma wins
johanflod : Rapha is done
mhj050178 : happens if you train duel against noobs all the time i guess
hosenkacker2k16 : rapha is old Kappa
gazz12__ : NA quake EleGiggle
okelf : rapha go back to ow lul
johnfoe : so rapha is the best NA has to offer? Good grief.
Recludos : best NA player EleGiggle
Kanivakil : Rapha is not CHAMP! This is quake champion, not quake live!

twitch chat is retarded tho.

Why take it away from gelleshak.. People were also spamming the same shit when rapha dropped a map against Zorakwar (who really played great to be fair) in quakecon, saying that he was over and that evil would smoke him in the final. Well, guess what, rapha destroyed him 3-0 in the finals. lul

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSgA_nK_w3A&a...p;t=12m37s

"People just want something to talk shit about."

Unfortunately true.

If we're talking about last years final, Evil just choked that matchup to Rapha, was definitely the better player on the day minus the really stupid decisions in the last minutes.

Now your replies are starting to make sense...

People have trouble to understand that rapha is really good, but so is gelleshack

Dandaking balls of steel.

1 mill tournamenmt and they fail to provide all games....and no onecomplains here also...brainwashed ppl

Dan is danger.

Im portuguese, busdriverx is from UK and syndrom is from poland btw :D

lul fixed :)

Sacrifice still unwatchable.

it's watchable when you follow good teams playing and you play the game yourself so understand what's going. I bet you ain't playing sacrifice?

Been playing Quake since the first, and even I have a hard time following a sac match with 1st person pov. Now imagine a complete stranger to Quake try and watch, that must be more frustrating for them than playing. Sac needs the fixed cameras in the levels to be properly used to truly become spectator friendly.

yeah they just need to turn off follow killer, and maybe auto spec those who have the skull or powerup.

Yes, I don't play qc. The only watchable moments are when the anarki's are flying around the map, the totem dancing with players exploding every 0.5 second is a big part of what you see on stream though.

Once they give us the ability to stick to one player or follow who we want like on an HLTV that issue of messy spectating where you follow killer and watch someone different every 2 seconds will not not exist anymore.

Any team mode like TDM or CTF would have the exact same issue.

noctis is from Austria, not Australia

First time on ESR? Welcome, our new friend, and have fun!

hi noctis, wp yesterday

CoolStoryBob

They should consider lowering the FoV from their 120-ish to something more common, e.g. between 100-110.

The current high FoV sure makes their game look fast, but it is tiring to watch. It makes everything far away, and the abscence of brightskins aggravates it.
It looks cool at first, but I don't like having to concentrate to distinguish shit through this fish-eye crap. Any noob plugin-in out of curiosity probably stays 2min before switching to something less headachy.

I don't think 100-110 is more common in QC. Actually, the more common is probably 130.

[img1]

[+]

\:D/

I would suck dick for brightskins. The only good thing about specing sacrifice is team colors (barely)

Unfortunately, the organisers don't bother with uploading the VODs to YouTube, so I hope they won't mind me doing that: https://goo.gl/V9vSK4

Avek vs Cooller?

AHAHAHAHA GOOD ONE :D

I feel so fortunate to have watched that, it was really great game

They will probably upload them and I'd suggest you don't do this in case of dmca.

well, they didn't do it before... almost impossiple to find the official videos like this - only the full 10-11 hrs VODs :(

From what i can see they are starting cut games more often. Sounds like you're trying to rationalize stealing other peoples work and uploading as your own

oh, the 4Seasons SS guys are here! :) nope, I never say the videos are mine and I link all of them to the official channel. say "hi" to your crazy designer.

and don't worry, nobody will ever steal anything from you. ppl don't like nazi symbols anymore http://team102.ru/img/web/4ss.jpg

he's in Russia, America can't do shit :p

America can't do shit anywhere, but I'll just delete the videos if the guys will ask me to do it. They (id Software and ESL guys) know me and they've got my contacts in Facebook and Discord. So once they will want me to kill the videos - that will be no problem.

If anything you're doing some promotion for the game, they haven't got much to lose by you releasing videos of something which was streamed live for free and will eventually be uploaded as free VOD's.

yep. and that's why I hope they don't mind me uploading the vods.

nvc, anyway that's not the matter of money :) I'll get like $0,5 for those videos in the end of the month. I just upload as much Quake contect to most popular Quake website in Russia to make the game bigger here - just coz I love it and that's my hobby :) And ofc I link all the official websites. If the organizers will want me to stop, I'll just stop. The only bad thing is that the event will become less popular over here.

Can't you just demonetize them completely?

I mean, if it is copyrighted, it doesn't actually matter whether you're making money, but it's probably better not to be.

they are demonetized. but the channel is monetized overall - I get the subscribers for videos so that brings me money.

I see. That makes it complicated working out the contribution of those videos. I think your heart is in the right place, but you can't be too careful these days.

Well, I'm just trying to make the game as popular as possible. And since the biggest Quake-related website in Russia is mine, that works :) And once again - the only bad thing that can happen if somebody from ESL or id will tell me to stop, is that Russians will get less info (therefore will pay less attention to the game/event).

Yeah, seems unlikely they'd care, but who knows.

Worst case scenario they'll ask him to take them down and he will. He ain't going to jail :p

This is so unbelievably untrue. They could file DMCA and have YouTube strike his channel, which could lead to his channel being shut down or unable to monetise both existing and future videos.

It's courtesy they ask him first, but it's also courtesy for Cooke to ask ESL. But hey, "risk" it because why not!?

im kinda glad that tox/stermy got knocked out since they can just qualify for duel in the byoc and gives more chances to new comers.

tough shit about evil though

they cant play in the byoc because the sacrifice games will be played at the same time as the byoc qualification.

oh then they got fucked :<

Really? Cmon, thats soooo crappy! Not surprised anymore tho with id fuckups...

don't worry, perhaps they can compete in the bawls chugging event

are you sure their specific match will be played at the same time as the byoc qualification?

At least we get to watch them win the sacrifice tournament, they're much better team players and even if qualified I wouldn't see them on the podium of duels. And I say that as a big fan of both since Q3 / Q4 / QL.

Dandaking n1

yesterday i thought kevin "strenx" riviere was a fuckup by esl, but did he change his name or something as they keep calling him that even today

he probly got married to a real man

I think sacrifice needs team damage, its too spammy.

I thought about that, it would be proper hardcore though :)
Imagine abilities like Slash's tray, Sorlag's puke or Scalebearer's bullrush when team mates are around :o

Yeah, was trying to imagine the same thing and if it could work. Overall I enjoyed watching it, but what a spamfest.

The lack of bright/distinctive skins makes Sacrifice impossible to watch (at least for me and I'm colour blind)

Still it's just a gigantic spamfest tbh and hardly enjoyable

the fact that id cant provide showing all games is so dumb dumb dumb dumb...1 million tournament and they fail to show all matches...their attitude hasnt changed - are there even ad's at youtube 4 this game?

So early, sacrifice even more, missing most of the Americas spectators for EU matches. Dumb decisions. Next time, split it between two days for each mode, and do the matches when both EU and NA can spect...

They can watch it on VOD. And we'll all get to see the quakecon games anyway :)

I got an idea.

Somebody needs to code an 'auto delay' camera. The idea is that the way quake is streamed or watched is on a delay in spectator mode. So everything you see (unless you choose to not watch that way) would be 10 seconds or so in the past.

The camera would then already know which people on the server die or not and in games like sacrifice, it would auto choose to spec people that wont insta die. Like how if someone jumps on a quad and then you spectate him and he insta dies and then you spec another fucker and he also insta dies for like 5 times in a row everyone you are watching dies.

That shit would not exist with the auto camera delay.

Also when someone is about to get fragged, the camera could auto turn to third person mode so you can see the battle (like in quake 1 netquake, we didnt have first person spectating, and it was fine)

downside is that every quad fight you'd know who gets the quad ten seconds in advance -- the stream switched to his pov after all.

True but the auto delay camera would also see which players get frag streaks in the past 10 seconds, so you'd see a ton of amazing frag runs and sick plays.

And they may be able to code it so that it can see flag runs and caps (sacrifice runs too) so that you'd see a whole run unbroken

prolly requires more code than the game itself :D

This is what CSGO does! :D

...or replace sacrifice with a good team mode so we wouldnt need fucking skynet to take care of things.

we just need something similar to HLTV where people can choose to go ingame and free spec who they want, while having the twitch commentating synchronised at the same time.

Great idea! Never thought I would ever plus you.

Nice idea, you should post it on the official forum
Who knows, maybe they'll listen.

I remember reading a column here a while ago by some know-it-all, claiming that Quake was killed because tournaments focused on duel and not team modes like other succesful eSports games such as Counter-Strike.

WRONG MF'ER!

Team mode doesn't work for Quake, period (spectating-wise). Duel is what's kept Quake alive for so long.

This Sacrifice shite was a total mess to watch.

Back then we had a near perfect mode, lacking "only" spectating features. (And soon public servers got item timers and stuff like that, which was awesome!)

Now we're back a decade in spectator mode (unreadable text, impossible to tell who we're spectating, no "enemy color", screen going full black every 2 seconds due to VFX overload, no team health bars, no mid-game stats), while the mode they're playing is impossibly spammy, and most people can't even stack over 150 hp so they're dying like flies. This is NOT what Disrepute (and other, me included) was advocating.

At least there's quad/base overhead camera, that was high on the list of features we were asking for.

And if you check the old thread when me and frs proposed spectator features, big portion of the stuff was already available in CS:GO or even ezQuake.

indeed, all we were missing are decent spec features for ctf.

now we don't even have decent spec features nor a decent team mode.

Its messy but its fun!

Tdm was very spec friendly during the q3cpma era. Gtv made sure you could watch any match you wanted and with mvd you could watch any player.

The only thing that was needed was MM and a ranking system for the playerbase to grow, and possibly a betting system to make things more interesting.

I enjoy watching QL TDM and QC Sacrifice more than the duels. More actions and clutches going on. You can see a single player fragging several enemies and doing some crazy shit instead of that single play of A player killed B player in impressive fashion and/or beat him at chess by timing items better.

Watching good synchronized teamplay is more magical than someone outsmarting another dude.

I also got another idea for sacrifice. Give the obelisk a health bar when the soul is in it.

So instead of it ticking up and you having to steal it, you can actually attack the obelisk itself and it will slow down the ticking/count down.(only works when the soul is in it) So if you are just 1 guy alone and cant attack and steal the soul back, you can choose to just snipe the obelisk and do damage to it, to slow down the counter.

This means you can give your team some time to steal quad or rally and get some strat ready in order to fully attack and steal the soul back.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Lrbw4-vkFM

Damn man, the very guys who lost are exactly the ones that were sponsored by teams, Avengers by Euronics gaming and Alliance by Alliance itself. lol I feel bad for the guys. :(

Why Sacrifice and not TDM - More "spectator friendly"?

They wanted an objective-based mode, because it's the current year ;)

Nothing wrong with that in principle - it's supposed to be easier to follow for new players and new spectators. Except they forgot to make ctfish maps and gameplay tweaks to allow any metagame to actually develop, or allow it being followed by spectators.

Indeed, the current year.

Thanks

Sacrifice is more complex than TDM. More enjoyable to play and to spec IMO.

It's more interesting with an objective based more and combining the characters' abilities for attack and defence;

I don't understand the "objective based" thing. Every gametype has an objective. In TDM your objective is to get the most frags.

Because TDM doesn't tell you the way how you should get the most frags, the teams invent their own ways and in this sense TDM is much more complex than any other gametype. It is basically millions of gametypes in one. And the abilities in TDM and their combinations to use in attack and defence are the individual skills of each player, which is more real and tangible than pressing a button and feeling like you're a superhero.

As for how enjoyable it's to watch - I guess it depends on how well the teams are prepared and practiced to not let each other just play relaxed FFA and good commentary that conveys you current state of the game, each team's current areas of control and current player's role in the team. I think generally with understanding of that, TDM is way more interesting than any mode with artificial rules, because everything is real in TDM: you don't get abstract "obelisks" which you defend because you're told in rules to do so. Your "obelisk" is real and understandable: for example one of them is LG. You hold the LG and it gives your team precious resources in form of a strong weapon every 30 seconds. You can just follow the LG player and see how well he holds the LG room and it's already an "objective based" "mini-game" that is interesting to spectate by itself. If commentator is good enough to recognize which roles each team decided on for their players and explains what you see, then there is always some interesting thing happening on the map that you can recognize and watch with excitement.

Yeah, I don't really know if there is a good definition of "objective based". It just seems to be about establishing a location focus that the game decides, to keep players from wandering randomly or camping and spamming. I think TDM already has that, but the location focus is ever changing, doesn't necessarily involve the whole team, and isn't spelt out in a way that is clear for the beginner or spectator. It makes the player's intentions more clear. You can tell he is trying to get to that room to the the thing.

Your argument is still valid for an objective based gametype. Getting kills, controlling zones, items and weapons and having roles for each players are still here but on top of that you also have other things to consider as part of your team strategy such as a soul/skull to time, move across the map, throw at each other and then defend and attack a base on top of all the fragging / other zones to control / items and weapons to time etc.

In Quake Champions in TDM the composition of the team in terms of characters is not as crucial as Sacrifice IMO, there's also nothing to move across the map apart from your own ass.

You TDM guys are way too elitist and protectionist of your that gametype that you always try to put down the other gametypes as not as hardcore and shit. Sorry but TDM was always an obscure gametype with very little following apart from a small group of hardcore fans. It's time to move on my friend.

As I said, there's nothing inherently bad in introducing objectives, and allowing teams to ignore those. It's actually very similar to TDM in this regard (and different from CTF) - ignore objective A, be it an obelisk or an LG room, concentrate on powerup and then use it to get the objective. So that's all good.

However, in TDM, depending on map, there were different areas of control, and with time as strategies developed, it differed from map authors' intents. That's what we love about TDM and was never present in CTF-based modes (Sacrifice has a lot in common with TA modes, just played on unbalanced maps instead of equal rotated ctfish maps).

TDM is also more forgiving for maps. With time, tactics can develop organically to give the out of control team some space - without any update to the map. With obelisks, you depend on updates to balance things out.

This is NOT to say TDM is the only way things are supposed to be played, but just explaining so you understand why some people don't appreciate objectives artificially put on the map by authors. It's like... you can argue all day that bomb&defuse is the best mode and negating weapon recoil patterns is the highest skill in FPS, but we'll still say "it's a hard skill, but we have more fun rocket jumping". But we'll happily acknowledge that's a skill no Quake has. So no need to get offensive :)

Either way, Sacrifice's problems have nothing to do with being objective-based, so this discussion is purely academic :)

You call it "unbalanced" maps vs. symmetric.

It would be "unbalanced" if you just happened to have a zone attributed to you at random or by coin toss, the reality is your base is determined by your choice and how you play. If you score the first skull of the round you get to choose what base to have, it's not random.

It can also be part of the strategy to get the skull and make your opponent think you're going to go to the "easier" base to defend and in fact go to the other so that you get an easier route and set-up to there instead of being stopped on the way.

I find that more interesting than symmetric maps. It also makes the routes and paths more interesting instead of exactly the same thing both sides.

If everybody is playing the same map it doesn't matter how it's updated, you're all playing the same map and you all have the opportunity to choose what obelisk you want to be yours by scoring the first skull of the round there. It's also not set for the rest of the game, only for 1 round, so even if you do fuck that up once you still have a chance to come back. In TDM as it doesn't work by round, the chances of come back are vert slim when you fuck up badly at some point in the game, we all know that. A round base game allows for more epic come backs.

I really enjoy playing and watching TDM, I just believe from playing and watching sacrifice that there is more depth to it in a certain way as more things are involved. It has a nice mixture of elements from TDM, CTF and Domination all in one.

I see where TDM'ers are coming from, but they also need to understand the perspective of why this gametype is great. TDM hasn't disappeared, you can still play it in Quake Champions, and there will most likely be cups and other competitions for it, it's just not the main gametype just like it wasn't the main gametype in any of the most recent quakes.

I don't understand why quakers never want any changes or novelty. Everybody was sceptical as fuck about QC, now it turns out that most people play it even many of those who complained about it. Please stay on Q1/Q2/Q3/Q4/QL if you don't like QC, I for one very much enjoy it just like I enjoy all the other quakes.

If you score the first skull of the round you get to choose what base to have, it's not random.

I said it wasn't "balanced", not random. Scoring the first soul is, however, very random currently (not just because it spawns so fast, but because the mode is so spammy you can't really get much of a "control" between similarly skilled teams), so who gets that choice still ends up being pretty random - but that wouldn't be a problem on a rotated (note: not mirrored) map.

"Fortunately", the whole game is pretty much FFA, so the end result is decided by weapon accuracy and spawn luck, which between identical teams would basically be random anyways :)

It also makes the routes and paths more interesting instead of exactly the same thing both sides.

Sure, more interesting, but it also invites speculation "what would happen if they had an even playing field". This is something I disapprove, after explaining to my friends how esports = sport :)

In TDM as it doesn't work by round, the chances of come back are vert slim when you fuck up badly at some point in the game, we all know that. A round base game allows for more epic come backs.

TDM was played in 20 minute rounds with 2-minute powerup cycle. This allowed for 2-minute periods of one team's control, then switch. Yes - you preserved "state" between rounds, but with low skill gap, that was never a problem.

Splitting game into rounds doesn't guarantee that they will be close - it's just a reset, and if skill gap is high, it's only a very short break from getting beaten. And to be honest, if two rounds end up 100-99 100-99, without resets it would be 2:1, not 2:0 in sacrifices - so that score would look closer when compared to having rounds! (And actually, every score would look as close or closer, and some games that end 100:90, 0:100, 100:90 would be a win to the other team).

So the only reason to have them at all is to allow for switching bases. Oh, and commercial breaks.

And I don't get how making something easier makes it more epic. I nearly shat myself witnessing a 50 frag comeback in TDM (come back fearzzz, we miss you!) specifically because it was so hard. Also remember: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSgA_nK_w3A (he correctly notes that epic moments can't happen if developers don't allow for impossible skill ceiling)

I don't understand why quakers never want any changes or novelty.

But we all do! We've been asking for changes in Quake for ages and we're all excited to see a new title and happy to see those noob-friendly features like rare item drops and built-in skill rating for team balancing and match making. We're ecstatic about item timers and that everything is on 30 seconds so everyone can time (that 25-35 deal wasn't any fun, it was tough unnecessary work that we all learned and did, it was easy but tiring, so get rid of that and preserve actual skill please). OK I'm sidetracking too much, cheers :)

I said it wasn't "balanced", not random. Scoring the first soul is, however, very random currently (not just because it spawns so fast, but because the mode is so spammy you can't really get much of a "control" between similarly skilled teams), so who gets that choice still ends up being pretty random - but that wouldn't be a problem on a rotated (note: not mirrored) map.

Scoring the first soul isn't very random, you can easily set up for it whatever spawn you get, maybe not with much stack but you can set up for it. Regarding the spamming I do agree to an extent and maybe friendly fire would make the game a lot more interesting and calculated. What do you mean by a rotated map instead of mirrored?

"Fortunately", the whole game is pretty much FFA, so the end result is decided by weapon accuracy and spawn luck, which between identical teams would basically be random anyways :)

You can't possibly tell me that the whole sacrifice game is "FFA and result decided by weapon accuracy annd spawn luck and random between identical team". It's exactly the same in TDM if not worse then. The team with the highest individual skill and accuracy + spawn luck is a lot more likely to win in TDM too. So this is a pointless statement as it applies to all team modes and even more so to TDM than CTF or Sacrifice. Individual skill and accuracy is even more prevalent in TDM. In sacrifice me and my mates have beat teams who clearly had better individually skilled players with better aim and higher k/d ratios, and we still won because of teamplay, communication and mini tactics.

Sure, more interesting, but it also invites speculation "what would happen if they had an even playing field". This is something I disapprove, after explaining to my friends how esports = sport :)

It's an even playing field when you get to choose your base and it's not attributed at random.

Splitting game into rounds doesn't guarantee that they will be close - it's just a reset, and if skill gap is high, it's only a very short break from getting beaten. And to be honest, if two rounds end up 100-99 100-99, without resets it would be 2:1, not 2:0 in sacrifices - so that score would look closer when compared to having rounds! (And actually, every score would look as close or closer, and some games that end 100:90, 0:100, 100:90 would be a win to the other team).

Splitting games into rounds doesn't guarantee that the games will be close however it allows for a bit more margin for error.

So the only reason to have them at all is to allow for switching bases. Oh, and commercial breaks.

Resetting and switching base yes, but what commercial breaks? There's virtually no break between each round so there's no break let alone a "commercial break". If anything it allows you have a sip of water, reset your mouse pad or blow your nose or whatever you gotta do that takes a couple of seconds.

And I don't get how making something easier makes it more epic. I nearly shat myself witnessing a 50 frag comeback in TDM (come back fearzzz, we miss you!) specifically because it was so hard. Also remember: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSgA_nK_w3A (he correctly notes that epic moments can't happen if developers don't allow for impossible skill ceiling)

Sacrifice isn't easier than TDM. and yes come back are great in TDM but that's again irrelevant.

We're ecstatic about item timers and that everything is on 30 seconds so everyone can time (that 25-35 deal wasn't any fun, it was tough unnecessary work that we all learned and did, it was easy but tiring, so get rid of that and preserve actual skill please).

Yeah that IMO is great for team games at least.

I nearly shat myself witnessing a 50 frag comeback in TDM (come back fearzzz, we miss you!

Is there a video of that come back somewhere?

Well, the results so far are not exactly how I've expected

https://my.mixtape.moe/wxqfhl.mp4

thanks sladuog.

rofl

https://clips.twitch.tv/FantasticWimpyKleeTriHard

ROFL

TOURNAMENT HIGHLIGHTS

https://clips.twitch.tv/FaintShinyLyrebirdStinkyCheese

https://clips.twitch.tv/YummyShyCiderMrDestructoid

brilliant!

Haha :))

EPIC :D

https://clips.twitch.tv/DarkIncredulousMonitorEleGiggle

Just watched my first bit of Quake Champions on Sacrifice.
Wow, it's is such a mess to watch, I had to switch off after 1 map.

same mate, can someone explain what the hell is going on?! :)

We're still waiting for We're Talking It episode VIII, please don't let us down!

If they would at least stop switch pov every other second. So that the viewer can identify with some players.

yeah I agree they need to stop the killer switch pov thing. Just stick a player with good score for a couple of minutes and autoswitch to whoever's got skull or power-up.

Why don't you go watch your cs:go streams then and stop bitching and moaning about every Quake mode? did you even like q2ctf? (my favorite)

you need to play it to understand it I reckon. I've played it quite a bit this week with some mates and comms and enjoyed watching it a tons more than during the qualifiers. It's complex but very good.

Just go back to your life man. It's not worth it. Trust me.

https://clips.twitch.tv/TacitSpikyGullRitzMitz

https://clips.twitch.tv/TriumphantTangibleButterKappaPride
Vo0 revenge

well that was definetively better

Why cypher dropped from the team for sacrafice? Someone know?

He coulnt make it to studio?

I heard he couldn't get visa for some reason?

He qualified for the duel tournament, and he's sponsored, so surely he'll go.

Question remains: whether he'll substitute for deus or is the team going to continue without him?

Trumpo doesn't like weed smokers... apparently.

A visa to UK...

BUTTMODE MVP

I've split Quake 4on4 QWC Regional Finals Europe VOD into separate matches and uploaded it to https://goo.gl/pBjYPc - hope the organizers don't mind, but it's kinda unreal find the official videos like this...

W I N Z
I
N
Z

WINZ

Effortless isn't Canadian, just fyi... And Malvoe isn't dkt

H O R S E D O O D O O
O
R
S
E
D
O
O
D
O
O

Is this even happening? Or ESL just not caring to steam (and not letting others to stream either)?

https://play.eslgaming.com/quake/global/quake...ps-europe/

ridiculous, indeed

yeah it should happen and apparently will be the main seeding tournament to substitute the players who wont get US visa, at this point it's at least 4 people (Cypher, Av3k, Agent, Xron)
but come on... evil vs tox RO16 again :X seems like at least one of them is going to play BYOC

Tox can't play BYOC as Sacrifice groupstage is at the same time as the BYOC qualifier.

I heard evil was going to play at BYOC despite all the odds. I wonder whether this is trully so.

'at this point it's at least 4 people (Cypher, Av3k, Agent, Xron)'

You mean it's confirmed these guys did not get a visa for Qcon? Where did you hear about it?