Warsow meets UT

moar lyke, crash bandicoot(double jump) meets UT

UT has double jump.

2004 has double jump

Thats the only UT worth mentioning.

Its got a much different feel than Warsaw.

So...

You failed at becoming good at QL...so your solution is to create another bland Arena fps?

My intwntion was never to be really amazing at Quake. I preferred to make videos that can help other people. I got tired of the brown everything art style of Quake. Got bored looking at it. I come feom a UT background. I loved that style so much more. UT is dead so I moved to Quake. At the end of the day I wanted to make videos to help people out.

I wanted to make an arena shooter because I believe we have something new to bring to the table. From what I can see, nobody is breaking away from the health and armor system like we are.

"I'm not pro at QL so I'm going to make my own fps." How does someone even come up with that reasoning. My mind is full of wat.

Laskij is faggot, that's fact, but what is so new about not health and not armor? It's still generic Quake clone.
Or UT clone. It's dead for a reason OpieOP

I guess I'll have to reveal it then. I was going to wait until a later date.

Our resource management system is much different than other arena fps. Your energy suit is at the core of everything. Your suit powers your weapons and shields. There are two energy pools, one for weapons and a global energy pool. So if you run out of weapon energy, you can press a hotkey to toggle into your global pool at a cost of reducing shields. But it helps in really tough situations.

At the moment there is no plan for help pickups. Your goal is not to loose your shields so much that you are exposed in terms of HP. We may do minor health regeneration up to like 50% HP to balance it. Shields do not regenerate and your health is extremely fragile. It's like being caught with your pants down.

You will have pickups though. 25%, 50%, 100% boosts. Specific weapon energy picks ups as well.

You have to be very resourceful in using your weapons and taking damage. We've though extensively about our system and it will be well polished when we release Project Nex.

And our weapons will have some cool twists too. We aren't aiming to copy a game to satisfy that nostalgic feeling from yesteryear. If people want to play Quake, they'll play Quake, vise-versa for UT. We want something new and different. Its a waste of time and energy to just to exactly replicate a game with a new skin. And its not all that interesting.

Hopefully this helps with understanding our system.

Intersting concept but what im afraid of that since you are forced to be very carefull about ur energy resources it might end up in an extremely defensive play,where ppl are afraid to go out of the corner and run like rats and what is more advanced movement favoures those runners. Look at warsow for example,cant call that defensive game at all but when someone is running away it seems a weird catch-up game chasing for the whole map.

There are still pickups around the map for energy, so that sould discourage a ultra defensive playstayle. And fixing that just would take some re balancing of things which isn't too difficult to do.

give us a spiderman style gun...shoot it at wall across the other side of the room then we get pulled towards the wall fast :o)

Interesting idea...

it could provide so much flexibility too. you could have the ammo work like the translocator but with 1 bullet e.g. fire it once then it could take 10-15 seconds to recharge so you can fire it again

My partner recently brought this idea up to me, I'm working on a prototype for this in our weapon system. TBH if we ended up adding it to the game it would be game-mode specific, I don't feel there's a place for it in a ranked match. I just feel it's more enjoyable on a casual themed game-mode.

Thanks for the idea :)

if you limit it to 1 shot every n seconds i dont think it would be that drastic.

my assumption is right now you just have rockets that can be used for extra height...with this gun you allow an out of control player to reach items they otherwise couldnt (im thinking grenade spawn on ztn with a railer below)

it would allow you to combine too e.g. rj into the air then spider pull to the other side of the room

It's on our prototyping list, ill keep you updated on the progress in programming it. :)

sounds like shootmania or q2.

you mean....like....GRAPPLING HOOK!?!?!?!

tenchu style, yes

technu was $$$

lol, go play xonotic instagib

energy suit at the core of the game? sounds like metroid

if you do a metroid meets quake style of single player, that'd be sweet.

GL standing out in a small community that hates change (Arena FPS)

Well at least the beauty of a small community compared to a very large one means it doesn't matter if they all 100% hate something as long that something make's their own community. I bet TF2 has probably 5% of the quake community and they seem okay with that :)

I think arena people are more open minded than that. Its just a tough sell. We are also marketing to casual gamers too. Believe it or not they are even getting tired of the COD format.

shouldn't you be out throwing rocks in the streets or something?

We should all be.

Dont mind him (laski-gnorant), hes an angry 16yo twat =) .

"ROFLOLOL!!!1! iz no quaek, IZ so shiet HAHAHa, gtf0 with ya BS, u so bad haha".

It's called being completely hermetic to things u don't know and especially don't WANT to test out because you have an highly biased Point of View =) .

Looks good dude, wish you best luck to become as famous as the two greatest and more emblematic enemy brothers: Quake and UT ;) .

Could also say its mirrors edge meets tf2 (scout double jumps and rocketjumping) and even gw2/UT(with their double tap dodging, I personally liked having dodge bound to a key like shift though at least when I tried gw2). One thing I didn't like about mirrors edge parkour is it felt very scripted you could find ledges and pipes and w.e that you couldn't use cause it wasn't flagged to be trickable or could use but only in a very certain way.

Will be interesting on the timing and rules of things.

Is the second jump a small window or can be delayed untill you land(its reset). Similar to the tf2 scout.

Is the dodge restricted to the ground? Can you jump for extra height then dodge in the air for distance, then jump to change direction? I don't mind if dodge is restricted to the ground.

This may be completely irrelevant to their double jumping

I'm going to assume this game doesn't have air turning but if it does double jumping does make it a slightly weird. LIke in tf2 while air strafing as scout sometimes you'll want to press the second jump in the midst of air strafing but it gives a slightly unexpected result as you press jump holding left you won't go forward with that new jump you'll go to the left changing direction completely. Although I would say everyone prefers this result as you can do very sharp turns something to keep in mind. It's also really fun exploiting how jumps reset in that game, if you land on something briefly it'll reset the jumps allowing for 2 more jumps :)

From your replies I really like the health system.

Our double tapping dodge thing, it's an optional way to dodge. I have my dodge setup so I just push space while moving in the direction I want to dodge, it makes things much easier for me.

We are going to have different keybinds for those who want them, so hopefully that will make it more comfortable. I am all for it, especially since I play with esdf movement, I like to customize all the things.

As for the second jump can you clarify, I'm not quite understanding.

Dodge is restricted to the ground at the moment. Ironically when we have the first version, you could air dash. It may be something we experiment with. We just don't want overlapping dodging mechanics. We'll give it a test internally though.

Air turning like CPMA? Or just air control? The two other mechanics we want to experiment with are wall running (comboable) and sliding down inclines. Another cool thing is that some of these things are map specific to make each map more unique. I think wall running could be really cool.

Either or but yeah I was talking about air turning like in cpm, never really thought of air control as being a separate thing but I guess gw2 or mario(2D)etc would be air control where you can alter your direction in the air a little more arbitrarily.

The second jump:
I noticed with some games with double jump there's a small window that the second jump is possible. In tf2 on the other hand you could jump then fall for say 100 meters or indefinitely and still have the opportunity to modify your fall speed and change direction just before you fall to your death, thus saving you. I think tf2' version is funner in a defrag sense,so was just curious if your double jump worked similar.

Your game should include a default ijkl left handed setup and an option for moving the weapon models to the left side.

That is a really awesome idea, maybe even control over the overall scale of the weapons as a whole, left or right side of the screen.

Thank you so much putting that in my head :), ill see what I can do with the idea.

Agreed, its one of those things I love about it to. I may push it further and allow them to pull the weapon back some, so only the tip of the weapon shows. Just the tip. It's how I config my QL. I pull everything back.

A related usability feature is the fish eye lens approach suggested here: http://esreality.com/post/2565646/n-a/#pid2565646

If you think about cameras or almost any video that uses high fov, they always use fish eye, because it's more natural and comfortable than uniform projection (it's also easier to make a fish eye lens than a uniform projection one, which no one would want to do). Literally every skateboarding video since 1985 uses fish eye for example. As do handheld "GoPro" cameras, etc. It's probably just historical chance that initially sent video games down the uniform projection route. Fish eye is more similar to human vision and better for anything over 90 fov.

with xonotic weapon models

Our models are much different. The style is very Borderlands-esque.

I was just referring to the size, they seem gargantuan, but so are q3's at fov 90 with no gunY/X/Z changes. i wish you all the best in your video game development :>

They are quite big. The FOV in the video is 90. They will probably be scaled down later on, I want them big so that you can see them better in demo videos.

interesting!

looking forward to this!

Are you that Indian guy that streamed gameplay yesterday ?

quake rippoff + not quake 3, will fail


and please, never ever bind anything to a double tap, thats retarded.

Agreed on double tap. It's pretty fucking terrible.

UT made it work. It was incredibly popular for a long time. I like it. Everyone has their own preferences.

Double tap popular? Most anoying shit ever, cant micro dodge else => void.

Most ppl that were playing UT never used double tape btw, only hardcore UT players did. If you want a UT'esque dodge make it 1 tape bind or implement it differently.

Double tap = triple fail.

I agree double tap fail in general, but it wasn't that bad at least in UT

Double tap and jump to get up those ramp thingys on rankin was fun. Pretty much how you moved in that game while holding W aim slightly opposite to where your going double tap left or right where you wanted to go, I felt accomplished when I could do it while back-pedalling and running sideways heh. And with the newbs you always had people flying randomly left or right, I would say most newbs used it for its intended use(to dodge).

cant micro dodge else => void.

Incorrect. micro dodging can be accomplished by holding down BOTH direction keys and simply letting up on one of them.

UT2k4 was awesome.

Sure... you hold both = you dont move. Are you brain damaged? How do you do 2 micro dodge to left without activating a "ut dodge" ?

Holding down the other key cancels it out. Micro dodge achieved.

I played UT2004 for years man, I know what I talking about.

BTW this works ok in Quake as well, it lowers your reflex time since you're only pulling your finger off a key instead of pushing down and waiting for it to register. It gives you a weird movement and ability to dance that many players aren't ready for. Id lay money Cooller does it.

Yep. One of those neat tricks you can do.

Anyone who has played UT for a month in multiplayer is able to dodge or doublejump. If we talk about knowing how to make the most of all the movements I can understand that you speak only for hardcore players, but the double jump is really easy and very useful.

In 2k4 if you want a small movement you simply strafe or move in figure 8's / circles and it works splendid to evade peoples shots if you do it with spontaneity and timing. Double dodging is there to get around the map and create dynamic situations in battle. In particular the double jumping. This whole idea of micro dodging sounds like you want your character to just jitter back and forth really quick, which is silly.

You're right, everyone does have their own preferences. So why make us all use yours?

That's just the stock settings for dodge, Antonio prefers the double tapping, but for anyone like me who uses a cherry blue keyboard, I just went into the keyboard setup in our options, and changes the dodge keys around to fit my hands. :)

Pretty sure it's the same guy who made this.



At least, the voice in the video.

Yeah. Back on my really old youtube channel.

Nice vid man, you should make more of those. It really helped me when I was starting to get into duel.

Thanks. I haven't played QL much since then. I
I got into SC2 then made new channels that got 20k+ views. Was hard to go back. Plus I've always been more into UT. For our game there will be cool stuff like this.

Minigun :)) lolz

Looks promising. To be perfectly honest, Xonotic and Nexuiz Classic came to my mind because of the 'Nex' connection, as in the Nex Gun in those two games.

I've no experience with UT, and that series of games has little appeal to me- I just don't see the point for me to invest time in those games. This seems like it might be a very great compromise between the familiar and the UT once it gets closer to completion (Xon had the QW-movement/UT-style weaponry, this might be the flipside of the possible combinations).

Looking forward to it.

Wild guess that the name comes from the latin word meaning "death/murder".

Xonotic is getting rid of that weapon name in the future btw. ^_^

Correct :D

I was actually testing out Xonotic today. I mentioned our game to someone online and had to clarify I wasn't an Nexuiz developer.

About funding your project... kickstarter? No? Yes? When? :)

Better spend this money on hookers.

Yes to Kickstarter. Within a week or two hopefully. eedsit.com/r/projectnex to keep up to date.

Ok :) already shared, and subbed to the subreddit.

Thankyou. We appreciate your support. :D

What engine is this?

Unity

please don't forget that unity handles raw mouse input please please please please please!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Don't worry, we got it. I'm really pick on that stuff as well. I play with no accel or anything. But not quite to the extreme low sensitivty as strenx.

wow I didn't know :o I hope you're good with network smoothing shit. When I had to make my QL rip off (QuakeUnity) support LAN for uni the lag was quite bad for ages (and had some bugs on how it looked when move+jump on the other person's view)

Sad story, Unity networking was never an option for us. I've been using smartfox, but in the end we've gotta start from scratch when it comes to handling our main server.

oh OK~ never heard of it

What model. Free to play with skins? One time purchase? Subscriptions?

Multiplayer is free to play. Singleplayer is payed.

I also must mention this game is a high poly game. Its not going to be bsp based like every other indie arena shooter. The art style is similar to Borderlands.

Cellshading? ;_;

No cell shading. it only has the outline shader.

Gamers don't care how a mechanic works, unless knowing leads to an advantage. Explaining that a double-jump is possible because your character wears a propulsion suit is of no interest to anyone, unless there's other suits in the game with different abilities.

If you're hoping your game has a future in e-sports then I strongly recommend you rethink your game's aesthetics. When outsiders look in on what we're playing they only see the game's skin: the player holding a gun, shooting humanoid targets, killing people. This is a negative misrepresentation of the game, and it exists because developers have felt the need to wrap their game mechanics in a semblance of reality to make it comprehensible to non-players.

I think we all want to see this genre grow in popularity, both in e-sports and out. However, if little Timmy asks his mum and dad for permission to play Ultra-Mega-Arena-First-Person-Shooter 12 and they see characters holding weapons, firing at human targets with guts and blood flying everywhere what will they say? What will they think of the genre, or of e-sports that employ these sort of games?

I've talked about this issue with other gamers, and they sort of laugh about it, but right now first-person shooters are thought of as violent games, for violent degenerates. Is this the public image you want for your game? Drop the first-person shooter tag, the weapon models, and the human silhouettes. I implore you to create a non-violent aesthetic for this game.

If you do you'll have a game that parents will be happy to let their children play, won't be bad-mouthed by the press, and a game that, I think, players themselves will be happier with as it'll be a better representation of what the game's about: a game testing your mechanical execution skills and tactics. You'll also be able to provide your players with a better game-play experience, because you won't be limited to game mechanics that seem plausible.

Anyway, with all these competitive FPS projects occurring it'll be interesting to see all the final results. :)

Thanks for taking to time to write a detailed reply.

His suit plays a huge part in the game. The whole game revolves arount it in single and multiplayer.

Its not that we feel we have to make it realistic. Our singleplayer story is based on humanoid creatures. As for esports we would like it to be successful that will remain to be seen. I'm aware its not easy. It also may be important to mention the game's style is comic book like. Borderlands is a good example.

But I do get your point. I think the view on fps from a social perspective needs to change rather than fps in that sense. We are very aware of the stigma. The singleplayer series if very mature with lots of social commentary and complex situations. To be honest there is no easy answer.

If you want to please a maximum of your audience, tbh release a standard gamemode, lets say duel that "anyone" can play and give ppl a kind of option like:

tick "elite" to provide more advanced Competition oriented gameplay!

Then this "elite" mode propose a sharper gameplay and mechanics with tweaked weaponry etc.

Newbies could play a mode spammy game more, casual oriented, while, the competition interested in ppl can play and stream elite mode.

U create a kind of emulation for boys with humongous egos, if you prefer u lure them into their own game:

"hey brandon, lets play duel elite"
"huh no... i only play normal :x"
"lol u pussy, go to train".

The ppl just playing casual, would play standard mechanics while ppl interested in competition could play a cpm like mutator to use UT words.

You please both branches of the gaming tree.

You pretty much nailed our plan. We want a game that everyone can play and have fun. Everyone keeps focusing on the xXHARDCOREXx gamer with arena fps and forgets about the casual people who just want to blow stuff up on a spammy map. (I still love CTF-w00tabulious).

Our laddering system will take all that stuff you mentioned into account. Our map design will too. The great part is, we don't have to make any sacrifices for the competitive players. Everybody wins!

I disagree. Violence sells.
What (early) quake had and Warsow/Nexuiz/Warframe/UT(maybe) all lack is that genuine sinister atmosphere and Gothic architecture

I don't want to look at shiny space ships and green plastic Nerf Arena guns :(

But then again I'm probably not the target audience...

I'm opposite of that. I cant stand that style. Its so dull and boring. Its ao lifeless. Ut2004 actually had some maps like that. I like color and life. But its all subjective. No one style is better than the other. its about what matches your game.

When it comes to single-player, we will accommodate you. Our story revolves around our main character dealing with his lose of human limbs, Keep in mind this is not a horror game. There will be fear, I'm aiming higher then "Horror Game's", Well at least the ones I've played, They all use common tricks to make people feel fear there are better ways, And we're not afraid to use them.

I know that has little to-do with what you said, but I think it chimes in with "Sinister" and "Violence" our game is bright, but it just makes the blood stains, Vivid and real.

Kid not playing game because mom said no?
WAT?

It's all up to the parents. And plus on the esports side its mostly more mature people watching anyways.

GTA

Our lucky numbers!

Thank you for making me smile :)

I'm unable to reply on these forums, I have no permission according to the forum. :(

Interesting. I will be keeping an eye on this. I'm glad a crop of fast-paced shooters is being planted. Hopefully the harvest will be bountiful.

Same. People are getting tired of COD like gameplay.

Something fresh, I like it. Good luck guys!

Thanks! We hope to have more updates soon.

What sort of engine does this use? It's not Unity is it?

It is.
EDIT: I could tell before the OP responded higher up in the thread. There seems to be a sound distortion that is common in unity when you move away from a source.

We noticed it also, I've already figured out a solution to that. Please keep in mind, We're not really using much of the default systems in unity. We've got our own way of doing most things, we came from a UDK background, and picked unity because of the licensing. So far we've not hit any limitations, and there is no compromise necessary, we've got some talented programmers.

Yes I read into some of those fixes for the audio source issues as well, so I'm not worried. Good luck, can't wait to see a polished product.

I remember an fps cap in unity, something like 90 fps. Watch out for that.

http://puu.sh/74lej.png We encountered a FPS cap early on, we figured that out very fast. :)

N1

If you need any beta testers, sign me up!

Beta passes for everyone in esr !!!!! <3

We're planning on giving out beta keys, mostly to the ESR community. We can't being to repay being able to collab with a whole community, it's been an incredible experience.

<3 ESR forums

whee! \:D/ Sign me up ! ;)

My body is ready.

The reflection on the gun reminded me of the built-in gun thing for unity games.

Its actually materials done in ShaderForge. It has a cubemap applied to it.

best of luck

good luck guys!

not bad, good luck!

"complexity of UT weapons"

UT weapons were not complex. Overall the UT99 weapons double up on too many different fire modes. 2k3/4 made it even worse due to many factors.

The main things - 1 low damage, high rate of fire histscan / 2 slow area effect detonation on impact projectile / 3 high damage low rate of fire histscan are doubled up.

1) Mini + pulse beam
2) rockets + flak alt (to a lesser extent ripper alt + shock alt). Also combos.
3) shock + sniper

About the only "unique" fire mode is the pulse non-beam mode or grenades which were both pretty useless.

What does this mean for game play?

It means you can get the "main" attack modes easily from less weapons. It detracts from the game and makes the weapons less important because you can get the same attack type in too many ways. For instance on deck - you had two rifles and two shocks - four opportunities to get a rail style weapon.

Everything becomes homogeneous, not complex.

I hope you decide not to double up too much :)

Fair points, from my personal experience with UT it didn't seem homogeneous with the exception of shock and sniper/lightning rifle. Most weapon had a place/utility or just used a filler cause you didn't have X weapon already, caused some unique fights because of that. I saw the flak alt as just another grenade to lob below or above at medium distance, flak up close is what got kills. UT probably had the most weapon variety for gameplay opposed to say quake where rockets or lg dominate with probably 30-40% use each.

For anyone who knows UT, does aiming at the feet with flak concentrate the spread, that technique seemed to be the number 1 thing that owned me in duel.

The point is you could remove mini or pulse (the hitscan portion) and it does not change the game all that much. Yes they are different, but only a little. In ut99 they were almost the same dmg output.

The same goes for rockets + flak ball. I did forget to mention flak spray thing.. but only because it was not that useful in ut99 duel. In 2k3-4 it was buffed and more useful, but because of how hitscan centric the game became it did not matter that much.

excuse me but each weapon, wether u like it or not, has it's own utility in the right situation are are not "useless" at all, the FACT ppl use it stupidly is not a proof to say its useless or not.

Link and mini are the same?huh, quite not no...

Try to finish someone that is far away from you and you know low, use link sec(secondary fire) gl with that esp if the guy has close range weapons...That's where the stinger comes to the scene =) .

So ye, go with your sarcasm "weapon complexity of UT" all you want, it simply is the case.

You know the guy is low and has close range Weap.? Mini him from far away, he doesn't? use link secondary (it does less dmg,7hp per cell, but it prevent ppl to dodge if the link is accurate enough. It also denies you taking a lift also).

Then u could say that for the mg in quake. "It's like the same than lg" somehow.
It's an hitscan that you could use to finish up someone that is far away (out of lg range), or you could use lg if hes mid/close (while link sec would be used for close range only) the lg has the knock back while the link gun sec. has the lockdown features. Either is useful in a particular situation just like mini/link.

Also, your flak=rox , nice try but no. The flak ball will then be used to spam an area while being out of sight (arch trajectory, hello). It can also be used like a rl at close range though, i agree. It's not 2 weapons to do the same thing though,no. Maybe if you over simplify the different possibilities it offers youin that case why not.
It's more like 2 different weapons help you to overcome precise situations a different way.

Wanna spam out of sight or secure an area/corridor?

-Bio prime would be like setting a goo pool trap on the ground
-Flak sec to instant spam a precise point BUT to lob an obstacle or sthg likes ql nades but instant
-Rox prime to instant spam a point in a straight line fashion or nades (like in quake too) to spam an area with some delay.
-You could use link prime to spam a narrow corridor like u would do with plasma in ql
-You could use mini secondary (ut3) to use the knockback and push ppl away from the map/in void etc (deck/sentinel and many more).

It offers you more solutions to different problems/situations. it does NOT necessarily means it's better but also does NOT necessarily means it's worst than in quake, like AT ALL :/ ...

In quake (that i insist, i like a lot): For say:

Situation A (spam an area)
-> instant straight line =rl/lg spam
->Delayed arch trajectory =gl
->Long corridor spam=pg

In UT(3)
Situation A (spam an area) :

-> Instant straight line= rl (possibly combo depending on the distance)
->Delayed arch trajectory= grenades
->Instant Arch Traj.=Flak sec
->Long corridor spam=Link prime
->Long corridor spam with possibility to push someone where you want him to=Stinger sec (lower RoF, non hitscan high knockback projectile).

So i stop here the wall of fkn text (sorry :p) and no hard feeling to you, but u oevr simplify something u didn't measure the entire subtilities =) and trust me the different situations i establsihed for ut, any skilled UT lpayer will make the difference and use the subtility each weapon offer him to take as much benefit out of a very particular situation :p.

The only time I used the term useless was referring to rocket launcher grenades or pulse projectile. Fact: Both are useless. More on that to follow.

You are correct that there are specific situations where one weapon is preferable over its alternative - I did not state that this is not the case. Pulse beam/mini, rockets/flak ball, shock hitscan/sniper, and so on. In the case of the shock/sniper the sniper is generally better because it can give you headshots sometimes - in a game with movement like ut this is generally down to luck > skill, so please NEX guys, no lame headshots.

The problem is the “subtilities“ between the weapons are too subtle. Yes, everything you say is correct, however the difference between mini and pulse is not enough to warrant having both weapons in the game. Maybe having both weapons and then picking one or the other to put on a map is a good idea. Especially for duel, having 2x rail/2x high rof hitscan/ 2x rockets is lame.

I was pretty good at ut99. My posts were mainly aimed at that, which I thought was fairly obvious, but maybe not enough.

Sure the mini has unlimited (effectiveness limited by spread) range and pulse does not - in some ways mini is more effective at closer range compared to pulse. Pulse range is quite substantial in ut99 compared to the LG in quake. Dropping onto players is better with pulse (damage from each segment that passes through the target) but at the end of the day the weapons are pretty much the same.

Likewise the rockets vs flak alt. However for longer range rockets are limited to spam only. Due to dodge anything outside ~flak ball range is pure guesswork - and that is being generous. So yeah, rockets go a lot further, but so what? Its only going to be spam beyond a certain point.

I am glad you brought up grenades as they highlight another problem with two firemodes on weapons. ut99 grenades (from the rocket launcher) were useless. There was never a good reason to ever use them. Why? Because they used the same ammo as rockets, they used the same weapon as rockets and if you wanted to be effective you used rockets. If you wanted to.. do anything else you could use nades and achieve nothing.

Similar to pulse for the projectile mode on the pulse. The beam was so much better that you were wasting ammo by not using it. You would be better off swapping to pistol rather than trying to use it outside of the range. Plus the range on pulse

I guess weapons with one useful firemode are preferable to completely useless weapons like ripper and bio. Not to say I dislike qw/q2 tiers, but tiers are not well done when they consist of 6 good guns / 2 useless guns.

You wrote all that and did not talk about combos. I'm impressed.. sort of.

To recap - You are correct but at the same time really did not say anything. Yes weapons have mildly different applications but removing one of them would not break the game significantly :)

To add a little bit more - I am not against multiple fire modes and lots of weapons. I am against things that double up and are similar.

eg - instead of flak having the flak ball the way it is, have a quake style shotgun firemode and the traditional "flak" shot as well. Vary damage for different ranges or something. One for upclose, one for around corners, etc. There, unique and not just another rocket launcher.

Well i'm glad u didn't get that replay as an attack, i re-read my own message to understand fully your reply and some sentences could have revealed a false annoyance because they were clumsily built =) ...
Anyway...I know what u aim at with your replies, i didn't say i was totally disagreeing with what u said in your 1st message but rather u were over simplifying some situations. Also we more or less talk about two =/= UT (99-3) that are kinda close though.

So it's a bit useless to argue as we talk about 2 different iterations of a same franchise with particular features for weapons.

Well i didn't talk about the SR, true as for me, it's the most versatile weapon in the game.
If you would have only 1 weapon to pick up, it would be shock, like in ql it would be lg. Those 2 weapons are emblematic in each franchise and kinda represent their identity imho.

So, i just partially disagree with "removing one of them would not break the gameplay". I would rather remove some features.
Even though in their concept, they are very interesting, very very very few ppl use it correctly (like bio prime?) and then instead, i would try to find a more accurate firing mode to make it more useful.

Also i HIGHLY dislike trirox and flak snipe in ut (in general), that would be me there would be ONLY single rox and nades for the rl and a kind of quake sg instead of our flak prime and we would keep the sec firing mode, on that we totally agree =) .

In quake the iconic weapon is rockets :P

Thinking about it, the better "solution" is removing one of the fire modes and tweaking/changing the one that is left.

Also one weapon doubling up on fire modes is ok, the example here is the mini.

The problem with multiple weapons having the same fire modes is dilution of importance of a particular gun. The inverse, which is also not good, is making one weapon OP by giving it two different fire modes that are very useful. eg both rockets and mini - like in PK. PK was obviously designed around that weapon so it kinda works there, but dropping a similar weapon in UT or quake would be silly. At least the rocket launcher, flak, shock and pulse have less appealing, not as useful fire mode and both the mini fire modes are similar.

I think you should re-read my initial post above this one about the number of "rail style" weapons on deck.

I don't really want to talk about specific changes to UT weaponry*, the games are dead, and even if they were not getting anyone to play with tweaked weapons would be impossible. However taking a step back and discussing short comings is fine as hopefully other developers are reading this thread and taking stuff on board :)

*Shall we move on to the broken armor system in ut99 next. :D

I just love lobbing it around corners hoping for some damage and getting a frag. feelsgoodman.jpg

I get your point. We wont have weapons that overlap as much. I mean complex as in the multiple fire modes across all weapons.

Like for our lightning gun. My initial idea is primary slows the player down a small percentage, alternate fires a burst of electricity that is melee distance but stuns an enemy for a very short time.

Little things like that wont overlap like that. Each weapon has a purpose and use.

Stuns? zzz

Rather than stunning how about a knockback. This way the player stays in control and can effect their outcome rather than being rooted to the spot?

Plus it is more dramatic, combos well (alt fire knockback -> air rail) and would be fun in team modes/ffa in crowded rooms.

But it is good to hear that there won't be too much overlap :D I like the idea (your LG one) carrying to all weapons - where the alt fire is more of a utility thing rather than another fire mode.

I hate knockback, its too op. Plus we have other weapons that will have knockback. We will have a plasma type weapon where each projectile will have minor knockback for primary, and secondary like double the primary. This way you have some leeway to get away.

I understand why people like LG, but I really can't stand it. But you do make a great point, rest assured we'll still have a knock back type of weapon.

i dont like this idea of stunning (they cant move?). I'd rather just have an LG which has UT's pulse gun primary as primary fire & QL's LG as alt fire (i.e. easier to hit than UT2k4's link alt fire)

dont forget my spiderman gun!

They can look around and shoot, but just cant walk for a very short time. Keep in mind this is melee. We'll have to experiment with it and see what works and what doesn't. The pulse type weapon I'm theory crafting is planned to have knockback when it hits.

We are open minded people, so if it needs to be changed, it can.

Don't worry about it.

You're a kanga and there won't be any AUS servers, anyway.

loved UT movement, this looks even better.
good luck with that, hope you will succeed.
release?! :p

There was "movement" in UT?
W S A D
S
A
D
?

WW SS AA DD
SS
AA
DD

ut2k4 though

2k3/4 movement sucked. Maps need to be too open to use it properly which in turn makes the game too hitscan based.

What is needed is painkiller style bunny + ut99 style dodge. Possibly with dodge queuing - the way you can queue your next jump in quake.

This way you can move around smoothly* and have nice, but non-retarded^ in fight movement. Being able to queue a dodge off a chain of bunnyhops would allow the travelling from A to B movement (bunny hop) transition nicely into in combat movement (dodge).

*but not in a completely over the top way like wsw or cpm.

^like ut99 but not the stupid dodge+jump in 2k3/4.

Add autohop (but make it so non-autohop can attain a higher skill level but new players can still move fluidly) and you have a movement system that does everything nicely.

So far noone has really managed to do it. Either they take it too far (wsw/cpm/ut2k3-4) or not far enough (ut/ql).

Not a fan of autohop but I understand the sentiment of it.

Might as well make a completely new game with your ideas. They aren't terrible though, but I like their direction it appeals to the mirrors edge type of audience. Painkiller with dodging would be to much for a lot of people, just thinking about it is intense.

Thanks for the suggestions. I agree to an extent on 2k4, it was a bit too floaty, our gravity wont be so insane. Its also important to mention that each of our walls has a custom script applied to it that we can tweak the force of jumps to really fine tune and streamline the map.

I'm not a fan of autohop, but I get the sentiment and its not necessarily a bad idea, but not what we are going for. However, I want the timing to be more forgiving on the dodge combing so it still feels really smooth. I would love the fluidity that strafe jumping has.

We'll find that happy medium. Its a lot of tweaking and numbers, but we'll get there.

Great ideas though. Thanks again. :D

Lots of movement. I'd argue players moved around more often in UT an in Quake. In UT you cant get away with some of the camping tactics that would work in Quake when it came to trying to punish people for going for big powerups.

Thank you, we've got no set in stone release date. But we're moving at such a wonderful rate, with a good hard working team.

Greenlights right around the corner, we've just got lots of refining to-do right now.

https://twitter.com/nexfps

are you reachable via IRC?

We've not put an IRC up yet, but we've got the twitter :) https://twitter.com/nexfps

We will work on getting some IRC soon, Thank you.

To be honest I don't think it looks good from that video. The first thing I noticed is the view bob even when standing still - who thinks this is a good idea for an arena shooter? The jump has almost no height, but that's a minor issue compared to the jump mechanics shown. Why is a dodge the same height and more distance than a double jump? Dodging removes all predictability of movement and just allows a drastic movement change with the simple press of a button.

The view bob is an option for the settings, it was only on for the video. These are mainly things for our single player. Its completely removable. We will have a lot of customization for things like that.

And on the second aspect you are right, its why we are swapping them back around. I wanted to try it out his way and I agree that it doesn't work. Double jump is much higher and side dodge is more for evasion is how I'm going to balance it.

Sounds good. I don't remember how double jump worked for UT, but don't make it like tf2 scout where you can suddenly change direction in mid air because of the same unpredictability reasons.

Currently double jump can be used freely, You can switch direction there's just a massive loss in velocity. All still being balanced, right now dodge has 0 air control.

Just to clarify, I think air control is ok in the quakeworld movement sense since it's a gradual change of one's movement vector that has to follow a predictable parabolic curve in exchange for more speed. Dodging is kind of lame because it's just a better version of strafing that lowers predictability and increases speed. It does let the other player predict the landing area, but it's always been kind of lame and unbalanced in most games I've seen.

I've gotta agree with you on the dodge, I think our solution to the dodge system is the combo system, We've already got a counter that keeps track of each "Successful Dodge" it resets itself upon failure, the higher your counter gets it improves the dodge speed+distance.

The real issue is finding ways to balance, in all the games i've played with dodge, it's been rough.

Here is the quote from our original movement list.

Dodge+Combo
"Imagine UT dodge had relations with quake strafing, our goal is to produce a child between the systems. Hopefully all parties will enjoy the outcome"

Thank you :)

the higher your counter gets it improves the dodge speed+distance.

In quake you push or pull back on a lot of jumps to avoid going too far or being short on a later jump. You can kinda do the same thing in pk as well but you don't need it so much because the geometry is a lot more diagonal jumps friendly. How would that work with your system, outside of failing a dodge combo?

Imo, being able to press another key to pull back would feel tacked on to the dodge system. Same thing with releasing the direction key, that's kinda weird. It feels right in quake because it's all contained within the normal movement scheme, might work with a dodge system but from a distance it looks awkward.

"gradual change of one's movement vector that has to follow a predictable parabolic curve in exchange for more speed"

Mind = Blown :D

http://css.gamebanana.com/textures/3582
????

I'm not the only one that would like to see actual mechanics instead of push button instances, am I?

We plan to have a lot of new people playing our game that might not be familiar with arena shooters that we might have to explain things to them.

But the type of video that you are wanting to see we will be doing for Greenlight. It's just I'd rather have a video that works for everyone.

Thanks for the insight and thanks for the textures. :D Really appreciate it.

Did you use the textures that I linked?

Not yet. But I'm sure they'd come in useful.

The ones in the vid look identical.

They are very common, they might be the same as these,

http://css.gamebanana.com/textures/707

Except ours are numbered better. They are just some prototyping textures, We're got a couple of photographers in our team, we plan to make more our game textures with our drawn style, using our photography as a base.

nyro was the first to go way deep into all of the colors and shades, so I thought it may have been a neat coincidence.

They're numbered a certain way because the solid orange is already labeled by default.

we will :D thank you for offering your service!

One of our Rocket launcher concepts, but I've already done a lot more adjusting.


Here is one of our rocket launcher models
http://i.imgur.com/W05GccQ.jpg

Ahh, what did you make that with?

3ds Max 2014

looks nice

Why all new games keep having that gay techy vibe, where is the rawness of Q3 and QW

that can be found in q3 and qw

G I B S
I
B
S
< 3
Castles, blood, monsters, swamps, dirt, cum

<3 we love gore :P

Mate if you want rawness ultrono arena is available for you.

kinda unimaginative, i agree

good luck, hope it ends up awesome!

I think it will at least be pretty awesome. :)

walljump please, not walldodge, sounds retarded

We now have wall grapple. You can also grapple and slide and dodge from wall to wall. Grapple lasts a few seconds before you begin to slide down the wall.

lmao.
anyway, stop calling it walldodge, like i said it sounds retarded

Wall Crouch

We've got major issues with naming our features, hopefully we will find good names for things. :)

I call it "Walljump" Myself, which is what it is. I sometimes feel like antonio is trolling me, when he calls it "Walldodge"

Ceiling dodge. I'll call it wall jump to stoop the confusion.

Just call it "Walling"

Dodge jump distance appears to be too large. I’d suggest decreasing the distance and add dodge-jump. An extra jump you can execute after a dodge. Think ut2k4 movement.

Also if you add a shockrifle a like weapon then I’m definitely interested and possible donating.

We are using 2k4 as a baseline. But much less floaty.

We plan on having an ASMD type of weapon. Proper shock combos it was set apart the haves from have nots.

please, no shock combos

For some reasons, i find this game really attractive.

And for some reason our game finds you attractive.

It was fate that we met.

hope something new with movement, some new ideas.

We now have wall grapple. You can also grapple and slide and dodge from wall to wall. Grapple lasts a few seconds before you begin to slide down the wall. And we also have the ability to combo dodges that reduce cooldown time and increase dodge distance.

sounds good and intresting!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z5sqPxbLmIU
1:56-2:04. THIS IS SICK!
I would love to see some wall jumps like that (with viewbobing/different angle , like in Alien games. It may be possible just in some places (magnetic walls) or with some boost boots for 30sec etc.
1:47 good too! I would love to see jump + grabling to edge (slow like that), so its risky to do in fast fps game.

Ever play Prey?

Wall gravity.

Make the game look good....

That is our plan. We actually are steering away from making everything out of BSP. I want it to be a somewhat high poly game with lots of meshes. We have all the awesome post processing we need to make it look awesome (there will be options to turn it off).

grapple was in quake 3 over 10 years ago. it was kind of fun but not really suitable for serious games

Its still much different. Its really dynamic and wont hinder movement, it actually combos with it. The clamp is more like magnetic levitation on the wall. Your character will have one arm out and a leg adjusted so part of his suit makes contact and you hover from the side of the wall. When you are moving and jump at the wall, it remains speed, you continue to slide across it like a boss. You can jump out of it like you could a normal all jump, then 'clamp' to a nearby wall. It uses a different regenerating energy pool specific to that mechanic. That way you aren't Spider Manning it all game.

Not my kind of game mechanics. Movement seems too bursty. Projectiles will have to be super fast. Kinda reminds me alot of warsow.
GL,HF though!

What armor system are you planning on implementing for duel? Are you considering different styles/timings based on game modes?

http://www.esreality.com/post/2563297/project...pid2563602

Since its nothing like UT or quake I guess theres not much point on commenting on it at the moment..

..except to say "TIE Fighter" :P

best of luck !

Linux?

Yep. :D

No terrible mspaint artwork anywhere and no getting butthurt over criticisms? What kind of developers are you? Fuck is this.

I really feel for that guy, stubborn as he may be.

Haha. I've been in the music industry for quite some time. And I've been doing film for as long. It takes a lot to even phase me. Its important to not put yourselves above others as a game developer, or in general to be honest. There have been many good ideas in this thread that we are taking into consideration internally.

Though Samuel_Davies post is pretty funny.

Jesus, a reasonable dev posting on ESR, where is the world coming to.

Good luck with the project, will be keeping an eye out.

Thanks for the kind words. If you want to keep up to date:
reddit.com/r/projectnex
@nexfps
nexfps.net

Every month i see a new arena fps game project. All thoose shity stuff all sounds terribly wrong. Seems like people are trying to create a game to kill Quake but none succeed.

Yeah excuse me if i have no positive things to tell you. We are happy with Quake and it's "primitive" dodge as you descibe it. While there is no real Quake dodge in your video (ie no skill, ie i press a button and i dodge).

Oh and about your project, that sounds like deja vu. Those movements and shits won't attract anyone. Been there done that.

You try mixing Mirrors Edge with UT. Sounds like the result is a vomit puddle.

*meow*

Cool story bro. If you want to play Quake, its there for you to play. Also, we aren't Mixing Mirrors Edge with UT. Only the ME art style.

Thanks for the good laugh though. Unsuccessful troll is unsuccessful.

As if i care, as if you realy laughed at my post. I am a little bit surprised to see that you answer by the derision, most certainly because what i said is 100% valid and you're too young to accept it.

Tell us, why would your project be more succesful than Reflex or Reborn or Warsow or Xonotic or etc... ?

You say you are only taking the Art style of Mirror's Edge, that's a lie, the backflip and the wall slide you showed and the surface on which you did it etc all this is exactly Mirrors Edge.

There is no Quake strafe (what people call real strafe) in your video, thats 100% true, another valid point for me.

The dodge you propose is a dumbed down version of the UT2004 dodge/jumps with dodge and double jump.


So since all what i said is blatantly valid you decided to just answer by derision, maybe because you are delusional about your project.

Facing reality seems a bit hard to you, most certainly because you are not used to it. Oh and about the last point, tell me, which public do you aim if it's not clearly the Quake public? I dont see anyone interersted in fast paced (that is if we can call yours fast paced) Arena FPS. Except Quake players, shootmania players (lol) and maybe Tribe players?

Oh boy so much trolling :*
Yes so much troll and stupid points i made, omg much lol, such wow!

Bonus from youtube since you're a faggot :

"Camel Jockey says :
Please get someone with a good voice to do the voice overs. The guy currently doing it sounds terrible."

answer :
"To each their own. When I used to commentate Quake I got a lot of compliments on my voice. And many from TV producers as well. For the more detailed explanation we will be having someone else do the voice acting"

Get down your horse you're ridiculous. You never commentated any Quake. You clearly have a rich family and stuff that's cool for you, no need to tell it to the whole world.

Someone's mad.

The reason are game has the potential for more success is that it does something different. We have mechanics we are adding that set us apart from other arena fps. When the art is more fleshed out, you'll see our style is different than other arena fps. And our health and armor management system hasn't been used in a proper arena fps. Not only that but our multiplayer will have casual friendly modes and maps that non competitive players can have fun on. Nothing that has come out/is coming out has even considered the more casual crowd. Also, proper ladder and ranking systems with a highly social interface.

There are no back flips in Project Nex nor are there back flips in Mirrors Edge (wat). Our character doesn't run on the wall, you just jump off of it. Wall run was a proposed idea. And that mechanic is also used in Titanfall and the one Matrix game for the PC (and many more games I'm sure). I thought it looked neat in Titanfall, so I wanted to see how it worked in the context of our game.

We've stated many times that the video is only a proof of concept for our basic mechanics, and that the other mechanics aren't added yet. If you had actually taken the time to read the thread, you'd see we have a unique system for our movement. I'm not repeating it yet again. If you cared to dig for more info, you would have.

Actually there is a demand for something new and different, Titanfall shows that people are interested in something like that. TF2 wasn't arena, but its popularity shows people like fast paced games. Look at Starcraft 2, highly competitive and its still a big force in the esports scene four years later. People do like difficult games, its just a tougher sell than it once was. Game devs underestimate the importance of advertising and getting their game out there.

I commentated Quake Live for the Autumn Duel Cup/The Rumble Pit back in 2011.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYgK2i08gDE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08Man879slY
http://www.quakelive.com/#!profile/summary/prettyawesome

Actually I grew up very poor. And never did I state my social status in any of my posts. wat is this i dont even

--
I get that you like Quake, and that is perfectly fine. www.quakelive.com I just don't understand how people can get so attached to a brand that the moment someone does something in that approximate area that they have to attack the other people doing their thing. Somehow us posting about a project and game that we are passionate about managed to be the straw that broke the camels back.

People with your demeanor and attitude are the ones that I do tend to ignore criticisms from. There have been countless valid and polite/stern criticisms of our game in this thread that are 100% respectful to us. Those are the ones that we look at and go "that might be a good idea". Thats because we know they didn't let their bias toward their preferred game influence their ideas too much.

Anyways, I'm not going to respond to your reply to mine, because you are an obvious troll. If you looked through this thread, you'd have a wealth of information about Project Nex. You only came here to start controversy and we are a peaceful drama free studio.

http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/39014503.jpg

1)
2:12 in your vid = Mirror's Edge Walldodge
2:49 in your video is the jump i was calling backflip. Same as Mirror's Edge turn over jump.

2)
About your commenating career in QL i hope you are just kiding.


3)
"I got a lot of compliments on my voice. And many from TV producers"
"Actually I grew up very poor. And never did I state my social status in any of my posts."

Yeah, poor people are close to lot of TV producers and shit, they meet very often ofc. Your falacies may work with most people here, but i saw what kind of person you are. Disgusting.

You'd be surprised at who you can get into contact with on the internet these days just by putting work out there.

I just hope it isn't yet another quake clone.

TBH yet another UT clone would be refreshing, compared to the said one.

Not a Quake clone, nor a UT clone. Though, we have some elements from both.

Considering Shootmania has elements from none of the two games, I think that's a wise choice.

I was dissapoint at Shootmania.

Well I'm interested. Only problem is newborn can never know of our secret affair.

Traitor.

"If you like what you see here, it will only get better".
And what if I don't, will it only get worse? :((

And why ws there a loop of a leather belt getting tightened in the background? How annoying.

Anyways, 'advanced' dodging doesn't make for a smooth gaming experience. It is awkward. Think of how retarded it is to try and hit a target that can do about any weird move, direction change, jump possible. It just isn't fun and rewarding, it's guess and get really lucky once or twice.
You will then pull the equivlent weapons out of the bag to hit such a player, spread rockets, proximity things, BFG-like mega explosions and/or aimbot build-in. Thanks but no thanks.

"And what if I don't, will it only get worse? :(("
As long as my heart beats, no <3

"And why ws there a loop of a leather belt getting tightened in the background? How annoying."
It's because our video was so tight

"Anyways, 'advanced' dodging doesn't make for a smooth gaming experience"
This we don't know till we are really up and running, we've written up charts and gone threw all the scenarios, on paper it appears to work and balance out together with our other features, if it doesn't we're not unwilling to make change, and correct our mistakes.


Thank you for your valuable questions, brohifive! <3

if it was tight already, it wouldn't need continuous annoying tightening sounds :x

'on paper it appears to work'
Oh, I don't know what could go wrong with that!

I applaud your enthusiasm though and hope it will last. if you can keep it going when things get serious, then you will definitely get somewhere.

the questions were rethorical, I will keep the brohighfive until there is something to actually play :)

Sounds reasonable, :) thank you!

Great job. But keep in mind. The more is game harder the less players u will get. Our kids play cod / cs style only. Why? Because its simple as shit.

Not necessarily, research shows people in general prefer harder games. Its has to do with how inviting the game is, and the map design and weapons.

Weapons are balanced around competitive play as are many maps. But there is also casual maps and casual game modes. Ranked and unranked play, cosmetic things galore. But none of this hinders competitive play. Cause even on cosmetics, we'll be designing it with competitive play in mind.

Casual audiences are actually interested in the genre, but game devs get all 'xXhardcoreXx' about it and forget there is a whole world of other gamers out there who want something challenging. Keep in mind the look of your game needs a bit of an update. That BSP based design approach really wont work as well anymore. Maybe in another 10+ years it will be a big gimmick like 8bit/16bit art is today.

The main reason we come to places like ESR is because you guys are the ones who will really appreciate the game for what it is, and are the ones that will (hopefully) keep it alive for years to come.

Nah. Actually some of the most popular games ever are quite hard, even harder than quake. The thing is the game should be fun and appealing at first try and this is where the latest quake in particular fails quite hard (QL), while the previous ones didn't as much.

Couldn't agree more, except I believe we can make it "Appear" simple fun and appealing, till players make it to the higher ranked matches, where things start hitting the fan per say.

Thanks for reading :P

Strafe jumping is considered complex for many people. Making movement the complex (or overly complex) aspect of the game probably isn't the best idea.

strafe jumping is an odd mechanic though. there isn't actually anything else like it in terms of depth. a double jump or sidestep with a button press shouldn't be too complicated for players to take on.

We want to make it simple and easy to use, except hard to master. IF we ended up making a mechanic that can be both learned & mastered in the same breath, we've failed at making a detailed movement system.

well take, for instance, the very simple concept of rocket jumping in quake. between the spash damage radius, directional movement and timing of a jump you have many possibilities of different executions and also failure. i think the machanics within the game should strive to create these kind of variables within the code, making timing essential, in order to create something hard to master.

Its actually pretty easy to get the basics down. By default dodging is double tap, if you want to wall jump, just stand really close to the wall and press space. To wallclamp/slide you move in the direction of the wall and jump and press shift.

The hardest part is combing the moves. And that is just a timing thing. Which is still going to be tough to master.

Shrug, just saying. I personally found strafe jumping to be quite basic ... but never underestimate the stupidity and ineptitude of the general public. :)

Strafe jumping or circle jumping?

Either way, both are a mechanic with an exponential output.

This is where we have trouble, Trying to make a game where casuals can play with pros.

Pandora's boxes have been opened, what now. :)

don't do it! let the noobs take a beating like good noobs do.

You clearly just dodged the tap.

But strafe jumping is not needed by default, only at high levels it is mandatory, that's the beauty of it.

Also wall clipping...awwwwww yiss. It is such a goosebump experience to see cypher, evil or others clip a wall perfectly in the midst of a chase, to get from a to b those milliseconds faster needed to plant the perfect rocket or hit the pixel rail.....I so love the QL physics like they are now, just absolutely perfect.

Strafe jumping is quite disencouraging in QL. For us experienced players it's great and maybe the reason why we still play and watch it, but for new players they just see opponents moving more than twice their speed and they cannot copy that, very frustrating.

From watching streams I quite like, maybe even prefer the Titanfall approach. Anyone can defragface, it isn't crucial and still looks great. Of course won't 'feel' as great as strafe jumping, but it won't make people ran away from the game.

That's one route to explore, I plan on making several variations of this system. It will take some time for us to settle on something.

Thank you for the suggestion, I've added it to my brain.

strafe jumping is more intuitive that bhopping though. Maybe mastering strafejump is harder, but getting speed and control is very easy.

ppl running away from strafejumping are ppl really not into a quake kind of game in the first place.

"for new players they just see opponents moving more than twice their speed and they cannot copy that" - SHOULD induce "I want to do that" as a noob. And you can, because the game allows you to, YOU have to learn. If the noob then are turned off the game by that, well then no loss, since they just don't get quake kind of game.

quake is easy, UT style is annoying. Dodge is fine, but when i game becomes having to CONSTANTLY double tap when moving around map, movement flow is not done right.

SHOULD induce "I want to do that" as a noob

Hence the need for a real generational change for any Arena FPS to make a comeback.

well then you have titanfall, but do you want to play that?

I was agreeing with you. I meant a change in the mindset of gamers, not the games. It's not about learning a mechanical skill anymore.

ahh, okay, yeah. sorry, i misunderstood you.

so you are making this in unity? i've played quite a few games on the unity engine and the feel of it isn't bad. raw input please!

You can do raw input in unity so I'm sure they have it covered.

Raw input was one of the first things Yashua did. Any of those pesky Unity problems and tropes aren't going to be a part of our game. :D If we do things right, you wont even know its Unity unless someone mentioned it.

Unity only does raw input, to my knowledge. It's why it has issues with controllers. Don't worry about that tho, we're actully using cinput for controllers.

Unity is bad at input, and it should feel bad.

i don't know how to put this across correctly but the feeling of the movement in some unity games is a little... stilted or stiff. with other engines (idtech, source) there seems to be a subtle deceleration as you come to a halt which transpires into smoother and more fluid movement. just hoping you get the feel of the game right because for most people here that is really important.

I don't think unity is to blame, This is an issue with the programmers. I know that feeling your talking about, It was our first concern, making the controls and movement feel good.

:) Thanks for the concerns!

Not only raw input, if you use Input.GetAxis. It has some sort of smoothing effect but I can't find any docs on what the smoothing actually entails.

How are you doing the hitboxes? Are you using one capsule/box collider or attaching colliders on the character collider?

That's a fun question, thank you for asking it's making me think. At this point all I can do is promise you, it will be accurate. Originally I planned to create my own sorta ghost collider system, so we could have a dozen hitbox's, we could then create slight damage modifications based on where you are hit.

If you have any ideas, throw them at me. :)

Thank you

You can attach the hitbox colliders right to the bones(transforms) of the character.

Is there any difference between this movement system and the movement system from UT2004?

Quite a good amount. I have made quite a few responses in this thread if you are interested to learn more. :)

Ok, I just watched the video and from what I can tell the concepts of movement are exactly the same as UT2004 (jump, double-jump, dodge, wall-dodge).

Hey :) our video doesn't really do our movement system justice, we've got handfuls of ideas and practical usage charts, few things have made it towards our prototype, and we decided not to show the super early movement features and there usage, if you stay tuned we will keep this thread updated.

Sorry there wasn't more in our video, I promise we will do better next video. :) Thanks!! <3

This is starting to sound too complicated.

1) Armor/weapon power, swappable between the two.
2) Dodging + wall jumps with walls reacting differently based on scripts.
3) What sounds like a combo/power up system when you successfully dodge, dodge further/faster the more successful you are.
4) Grabbing walls+sliding or grapple

I am sure there are a few more things I have missed. Like the weapons.

Sounds like its getting a little out of control for a simple arena shooter? Part of arena shooter/old shooter appeal is the simpleness of them.

To clarify - each thing by itself sounds interesting, all together it sounds too much..

When you put all the features in a list, it sounds very overwhelming, and looks and sounds complicated and clumsy. It all comes down to polish, and making the features flow together, easy to access, Simple guidelines and basic structure to the usage, the mastery of these things will be much more intimidating.

But to-be frank, this comes down to our ability to make these mechanics work together. Done right it should be pretty darn cool, done wrong it could be a complete disaster.

So I'm forced to-do something unfair and ask something almost unacceptable, Please trust in my ability to find a happy medium between perfection and chaos, I promise you there will be order.

Thank you, I mean for asking such an important question.

Oooooow mama,
I'm already having trouble becoming a decent QL player, so why is everyone creating new and different shooters out there...
Been playing Xonotic and Nexuiz when I had to...
Doing that I felt like Pamela Anderson hoppin' around the beach in the D-Day invasion...
How do you guys even hold your own in other games than QL???
Don't you have 2 jobs and three girlfriends at all, like me?
Some strange gut inside me even tells me to buy an XBOX, play COD lately, like 'why not give it a try?' Not good, not good.
Not good at all.
Not to mention Titanfall comin' up...
Time is my problem, I guess.
Darn, on top of it all, I'm a slow learner, getting old here.
Everyone...
PLEASE, PLAY QUAKELIVE ALREADY!!!!
I mean, with al due respect to those trying to boost FPS games, with good intentions 'n stuff, in the end, when you're succesful, you'll be taking away the already diminishing raw noobish meat, which I need to win once in a while in QL.

There is no good intentions, only profit. Thing is it's either an university kind of project or he clearly think he can make at least some cash (even if not a lot) with this.

That's the kind of questions he will not answer.

One thing that I get a lot of hate for saying is that the Quake brand is dead. The way the non Quake player looks at the game is that its old and out of date. New players aren't really going to come into the game. The brand is seen as outdated and stale. Same with UT. And when new people do come into the community, they run into pubstompers and hackers. Then the go on forums and see relentless posts about how the game is dead.

I personally do enjoy quake a lot. But at the end of the day the community is too small to really make a big impact on esports anymore. But one thing it does have is history and respect. I watch a lot of SC2 shows, when Quake is mentioned people know its the granddaddy of esports fps.

Wht.

Last non-quake/unreal game I played was BF3. The more competitive players knew what quake was and thought it was super hardcore + difficult to get into = not worthwhile. The less competitive, but still into-gaming-heavily players knew what it was and knew it was old/respected.

For a brand to be dead it has to be unrecognized - quake, in that regard is not. Unreal probably is dead.

To those of us that are older we think like that. But to the newer generations that's not how they think about it. They think about it as "who wants to play that old game?", all of us know how awesome the franchise is. The new generation has a completely different mindset than us about these things. And faster games like these are more likely to have younger audiences interested in them.

So I meant 'dead' in a different sense. iD would have to reinvent themselves to attract the newer crowds to their games. I should have classified its not a brand newer gamers think about. Its not on their radar at all. Even after Rage.

What's your opinion on client customization? Do you want the possibilities to be limited or plentiful?

It depends on what you mean by "Client customization" I don't see any problem in leaving the GUI for the client in an accessible area, where it can be modified, Keybinding is also really important to us.

Not to the same extent as Quake. There is a point where you can have an unfair advantage by knowing your console commands and the other person doesn't. But there will still be a lot of customization.

Customization similar to wow hud scripting. Also have a combat log so players can scroll back through their death to work out why they died. After playing wow and coming back to FPS I was continually looking for the log..

Graphics wise - do whatever pretty option needs to exist to get new players in and have a drab/flat colour version as well. The level of options to make bland graphics available in ql is not needed.

So far you guys seem really honest and I think you have a great approach towards this community, which can sometimes be hard to deal with.

Best of luck to you, and I hope to get to play an awesome game in a near future :)

It's great to see another arcade arena FPS in development. We need more of that. Unity was a wise choice and think it's wise to go for an art style similar to Mirror's Edge.

However, I got a problem with 2 things.

1. You said that you want to make a game that will appeal to both casual and core players. If your game is well balanced, fun and not too complicated, it's going to appeal to arcade-arena FPS players, period. If you try to make a compromise, you'll just dumb down your game. If you want to appeal to the CoD crowd, you would have to make an ego-based game that rewards players even for dying.

2. Gameplay-wise, I don't think you guys know where you are going with this and so far, I feel that the game isn't different enough compared to what already exists out there. But maybe I'm wrong, so I'll wait for more gameplay footage.

Good luck with your project and I hope you'll achieve your goals.

Thanks for the compliments and criticisms. I really like the clean Mirrors Edge style, and it just so happens it fits with our singleplayer campaign. Thankfully Unity has Beast and light probes. Sadly I'm having issues with area light. :<

I actually don't think any compromises have to be made. You keep the weapon balance competitive and the movement. You just throw in a decent amount of maps that can casual players can have fun blowing stuff up on. And reward people with more cool avatars, skins, trophies, points and so on.

We are still figuring things out. But I can say, side dodge is here to stay as well as wall jump and the clamping mechanic. We removed double jump. The last thing to test is the combo system.

As for the heath and armor system, "Our resource management system is much different than other arena fps. Your energy suit is at the core of everything. Your suit powers your weapons and shields. There are two energy pools, one for weapons and a global energy pool. So if you run out of weapon energy, you can press a hotkey to toggle into your global pool at a cost of reducing shields. But it helps in really tough situations.

At the moment there is no plan for help pickups. Your goal is not to loose your shields so much that you are exposed in terms of HP. We may do minor health regeneration up to like 50% HP to balance it. Shields do not regenerate and your health is extremely fragile. It's like being caught with your pants down.

You will have pickups though. 25%, 50%, 100% boosts. Specific weapon energy picks ups as well.

You have to be very resourceful in using your weapons and taking damage. We've though extensively about our system and it will be well polished when we release Project Nex.

And our weapons will have some cool twists too. We aren't aiming to copy a game to satisfy that nostalgic feeling from yesteryear. If people want to play Quake, they'll play Quake, vise-versa for UT. We want something new and different. Its a waste of time and energy to just to exactly replicate a game with a new skin. And its not all that interesting.

Hopefully this helps with understanding our system. "

to summarise what tidal is saying...give me a tenchu grapling hook to play with already

well if this game will have:

unreal I, halo I (level 2), and space environments

fast-paced movement which is NOT a carbon copy of quake or UT

vehicles in large TDM maps?

then i have something to look forward to in the future, good luck guys

There will be some fun space maps. And non carbon copy movement. I don't know if we'll have vehicles in Project Nex. But its been something under consideration.

Hopefully you are still interested. Thanks for the questions. :)

Have you checked UT3? The game is pretty dead these days but it's worth checking out for the dodge jump mutator. As you probably are aware ut3 has no dodge jump but some servers have a dodge jump mutator. It plays really well and is less floaty than 2k4 dodge jumping. Try the FA2K tdm/bta server to get a good feel for it.

Also worth taking a look at is hammer/piston jumping. If there was one game mode that gained popularity in UT3 it was vehicle CTF. In this game mode hammer jumping became quite useful. Especially combined with jumping boots. Check out the video to get a feel for it. Takes a few tries to be able to pull it off consistently.

hammerjumping vid

I hope you guys come up with a radical dynamic movement system. Wall or ceiling running, wall to wall dodges, fuckin spyderman moves. Anything that will create a dynamic movement system. UT dynamic movement really excelled at close range combat where you can dodge diagonal and practically dance your way into a better position whereas quake excels at getting quickly from point A to B using strafe jumping. If you can somehow fuse these movement system together and adding in some new tricks of your own you might be able to create something great.

hammer jumping is retarded and needs to be carefully implemented. Boots + hammer in UT99 led to very fast cap speeds on some maps, at the detriment of gameplay.

No vehicles, please.

I still have nightmares of jeepathon2k in CS 1.6.

=(

Give me beta... wanna play!

We've decided on removing double jump from all primary game-modes, and made jumping slightly more floaty. And we're trying to decide on the new default dodge keys, We're having issues making our combo system accessible, I'm sure we will have that all figured out soon. :) thank you ESR!!!! <3

How about pressing a modifier key + movement to dodge in that direction. e.g. shift+moveleft = dodge left. That being said, I'm not really a fan of dodge buttons.

Hey all! Just made a new video on our movement with a more detailed explination and some improvements we made!

even a disability-friendly map!

i'm a ut99 veteran and was skeptical about the new mechanics, but it seems you guys are finding a very good balance between normal movements and an over-the-top flying around sort of thing.

it feels a bit like a polished version of ut, which is what i personally would love to see.

does the dodge still go further than a normal jump? i massively utilised the side dodges because it went so far..

great work, also on the art concept!

I'm a UT99 veteran as well. Its what got me into game developing. The side dodge has a farther distance than the jump. Around 25% more distance. So you should feel at home.

beautiful..

are you guys implementing the instagib or sniper mutator or normal weapons only?

I don't see why not. It was on the to-do list for instagib/sniper stuff. If we get proper funding, we'll also have modding API for people who want to do even more cool stuff.

Will mouse movement have any impact on jump/dodge distance? I'm sorry if you've already covered this, but since I haven't found it I might as well ask.

In UT2004 you could dodge+jump and do a 90 degree mouse turn to get that little extra jump length.

This looks really good and all, but what about the culture of these new games? There's a few new DM games coming out, but they all seem to be made by small groups of devs. Quake and UT were big titles that had a following, what will these games do?

I feel like no matter how good a game like this is, it won't been seen by a lot of people and will have a small player base.

sorry to rip on you, the game does look nice (I liked UT too so this is cool). I guess I'm just tired of playing dead games that's all.

Thats why we are concentrating heavly on marketing. We just hired a community manager from a bigger esports team. Hes very into our game and has the know-how to get us out there. As you can see by the video, we like to talk and communicate with you all. Most devs seem to be too shy. We are also going to start a weekly podcast discussing our game.

We have a very well thought out plan. I believe we can make the game successful. We just need the support of the community.

I think I might have some weapon ideas, I was a huge fan of UT and Quake and I feel like I might have some cool ideas for weapons.

I could draw them up visually or describe them, regardless if you'd want some ideas I could shoot you some.

It's good to hear about marketing. I forgot to mention that LoL was just a new DOTA standalone, I'm pretty sure it grew from nothing. So it's always possible. At least we have people like you trying!

Feel free to PM me some ideas. But please keep in mind I have a lot of this mapped out in my head. You are welcome to send us some things you have kicking around in your head. Just understand that they may not be used.

Good luck with the project, I really hope it all works out for you! Roughly how long are you expecting it to take before you are ready to go into beta?

I don't have an estimate on it yet. Sorry. But when we have our funding we can better give a good approximation. Cause it means we could potentially have the resources for a quicker process. Cause right now the two people working on the game design/art/coding are just myself and Yashua.

really impressed with how involved you are with the community. wow so many updates! keep up the good work =)

Its really important to get involved. Just because I went from a player to a developer, does not put me/us above you. There are tons of great ideas and criticisms out there that can help us improve. Its just about having the right filter and making sure we still want to make the game we want, but not ignore a flood of cool ideas.

Not sold on the idea that its harder to setup traps in ut? ut99 especially had crazy huge explosions and super high DPS weapons that made traps + getting the drop on the other player quite effective. Defensive weapon usage is key here and ut99 did this a lot better (or rather you could front load damage a lot easier) than q3/ql.

If the game really was as challenging to play like this, "Wall clamping" for half a second is not going to change that.

qw has similar "run along the wall" mechanics that were used prior to bunnyhopping/strafe jumping becoming standard. They are not used today often and they are clunky and not fun. The drawback to using the wall slide is that the player moves in a very straight, consistent path - if you insist on keeping it don't add some retarded camera tilt.

Its nice that you decided to not have double jumps/etc because it makes it too floaty/air based, but when you are showing off the wall clamp jumping combos it doesnt look like it matters - you move huge distances in the air that mean the actual map does not matter very much.. and the game becomes more hitscan friendly because of it.

Interesting up to the clamping bit :/

You still can be more campy in Quake than in UT, but not by much. The clamp tactic was only a suggested usage of it. It was a more simplified example of usage to help more casual people watching the video to understand some of its cool usages.

Quake did it clunky, but our system isn't clunky like there's is. Its pretty straight forward to execute. We are still going to experiment with a camera tilt to see how it works.

Not to be rude. But in my explanation video I stated at least twice that I ramped up the distance for example purposes and that it was going to change.

very straight, consistent path - if you insist on keeping it don't add some retarded camera tilt.

He has a good point there, I think the tilt wouldn't be necessary. Unless you're bouncing off wall to wall there's actually some annoying disadvantages, chances are you're more in the open and you're also really close to the wall so susceptible to splash dmg; think height advantage with rockets but sideways :o. Plus straight and consistent is a wetdream for plasma and lg in a QL perspective.

Do what you do though :)

quake is more campy just because of the map dimensions vs the players....just look at them shitty corridors on ztn or the doors on dm6. then compare that with the really wide doors near the 100a on dm-rankin...even with someone firing a combo theres still room for someone

The more you give intelligent cricticisme the more you help the project. Tbh i have plenty of precise fix in my mind but i dont want to see this taking over QL. im just beein honest.

This is really happening.

http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upl...35igif.gif

<3

Let me alpha test ASAP and I'll feedback you into the ground.

Hey, looking neat so far! Getting rid of multijumps was a great move :)

How ever this wall clamp stuff? I... what? I don't understand its purpose. I can understand it may be used while you are being chased in order to fool your opponent - which could cause them to move past you. I don't understand it in terms of a 'trap'. It's such a short space of time suspended in the air.

With the wall jumping as well, it looks awesome and I'd love to play around with it. Although I can imagine if it has no limitations then competitive games could just turn in to wall-jump-fest with random intervals where people pick up weapons/items. I feel like the 'wall clamp' bar should also be affected by wall jumps. I wouldn't suggest any major limitations, because the wall jumping could be a massive crowd pleasure - I think it would be great to have limited wall jumps where you can maintain the speed you have when you hit the floor again. I could be blurting non sense, but that's what I thought about at 3am while looking at your update.

Keep on keepin' on!


edit: Understanding the wall clamp more now that I am awake, looks like it could be more entertaining to clamp & strafe along walls instead of just.. being stationary on a wall

I totally understand where you are coming from. Balancing it will be a bit tough, but thankfully Yashua gave me easy graphical controls to tweak numbers for balance. I'm paying special care to keep things reasonable.

Fantastic :)

As an avid and competitive UT2k4 player who's also played UT3 on the highest level, this looks really interesting. I loved the movement mechanics of UT2k4 the most as the possibilities especially with the shield-gun were many. I felt UT3 was a step backwards movement wise.

However I don't see why you've decided not to keep dodge as a double tap only because imo being able to dodge quickly and fluently with double tap was a skill in itself.
I don't like the idea of having another movement button on top of the array of the ones needed for jump, crouch, slow walk, etc. Otherwise it will just become a button bashing frenzy instead of a timed and well executed double tap. This is also what bothered me most in Warsow.
Double tap will be less hassle, those who deny it are just the minority of quake only players. It's not difficult to get used to. UT2k4 was the most popular of the UT series whilst also having the most variety in movement. Don't get me wrong as I played quake too, having played some competitively as well so I'm not completely biased.

And the thing about micro-dodging - if that's what you guys want to call it - can still be done in UT along with proper dodging as the time needed to register a double tap as a dodge wouldn't be enough to move your model far enough anyway. UT also has a setting to reduce the double tap time from default 0.25s, which I currently have at 0.18s.

And to those who say it's near impossible to predict the opponents direction with dodging - it's not when it's a double tap only feature. The nature of using double tap will actually help in predicting your opponents next direction. This I feel will be lost if it was a single button then we'll all be forced to use the single button instead of double tap as it will have an advantage.

I can see what you're suggesting i.e. there is a slight delay when you double tap that allows you to predict the direction of an enemy dodge from his movement on the first tap. However, pressing one button twice to dodge instead of another just once is not what anybody would refer too as a skill based mechanic, the balancing of it with micro-dodging simply makes it an annoying mechanic, nothing more.

Yeah... double tap...
Fuckin' retarded : ))))))
Add triple tap for more skill.

tap with your feet

The shieldgun was a pos and should never have been included. At least not the way it was - some sort of pickup might have been interesting, if only because it would not have to be in duel maps. jk it could have been interesting as a weapon + ammo pickups.

shield + boostdodge* ruined duel in 2k3/4. Was possibly interesting for other game types however. Oh also epics retarded armor system, but that was simply a carry over from the older titles so not really a 2k3/4 problem specifically.

*a movement bug that was not a good thing unlike the majority of quake movement.

Dodging smoothly and fluidly was easy. In fact it was so easy it led to people being easy to hit because of it.

2k4 was not the most popular - ut99 had more players for longer, at least in competitive game modes, ie not onslaught bs.

The Shield-gun's hammer was what I was specifically talking of, to use in combination with jump or dodge. Although, the shield function is fun to use to jump off a bio on the ground or rockets/flak nades shot at your feet to get out of a situation.
I agree it made duels more defensive, but then again it can be used in offence too to chase an opponent.
I think it would've been even better if the shield didn't last as long but instead be used as a street fighter esque parrying defence.

There was no boost-dodge in ut2k4, just 2k3.

Dodging was easy yes, but it's situation dependent.

UT2k4 had a larger player base for the past few years though. If there was a game that improved upon 2k4's mechanics, unlike ut3 then many of the existing players would surely hop on.

>The Shield-gun's hammer was what I was specifically talking

meh, whatever. Rocket jumps and whatnot are standard in this type of fps. hammer, rocket, shock ball, grenades. It doesn't really matter what. tbh I would prefer a pickup so mappers can design item denial and movement around it - see the recent aerowalk for qw guide.

>Although, the shield function is fun to use to jump off a bio on the ground or rockets/flak nades shot at your feet to get out of a situation.

not standard use = only interesting to hardout fans, and even then its not really "interesting". This is like saying the ripper from ut99 is interesting because you can stand up one standard step and it becomes auto headshot with centerview. This is not actually useful in any way, shape or form but it is still "interesting".

Wildly clunky mechanic that has 2-3 other variations in a game already. See my post ^^^ about doubling up fire modes :) Applies here too.

"I agree it made duels more defensive, but then again it can be used in offence too to chase an opponent. "

Never saw this much, it was basically defensive. UT weapons were already heavily already so this added to it significantly. Movement was also defensively slanted.. you get the picture.

"I think it would've been even better if the shield didn't last as long but instead be used as a street fighter esque parrying defence."

You already have dodge in ut99 and dodge+jump in 2k3/4. These are the tools for avoiding stuff. When avoiding fire - In general you should not be dodging unless there is a reason, for example it was dangerous to simply dodge back and forth in combat as it put you in the air and made you easier to hit/more predictable to place a rocket at your touchdown point. An item that "parried" for half a second would only be useful vs projectiles and this is the primary reason for dodging. Wait for rocket shot - dodge. Pretty simple stuff.

"There was no boost-dodge in ut2k4, just 2k3. "

Sorry, was bundling them together, 2k4 did fix some of the problems 2k3 had.

"Dodging was easy yes, but it's situation dependent."

I'm not sure what that even means in the context of my reply to you saying that "dodge quickly and fluently with double tap was a skill in itself."

Dodging as movement from A to B, while faster in UT was horrible and did not take very much "skill". End of story.

:)

Its funny, looking back lots of players bitched about ut99->2k3/4 and the main bitches were the weapons. I was always open to change and thought the weapons were fairly well done. Thinking about it now almost all other aspects of the games were the problem yet noone really cared about that back then.

Oh well.

You come across to me as more of a UT99 person than a UT2k4 one, both very different games. My posts were in regards to UT2k4 as that is most similar to this game.

Being able to dodge from A to B as you put it obviously doesn't take any skill. This opinion seems to stem off UT99 specifically, as in ut2k4 you can combine a combo of movement options. With the addition of UTComp 1.6 and onwards a small adjustment was made to carry over the momentum of a dodge into a jump performed straight after landing. These in combination can be used either to reach a destination OR during combat WHILST keeping your cross-hair affixed on your enemy - taking into account the little offsets created by movement to keep a steady aim, and also doing this as quickly as possible. Only a handful of players I've seen are able to pull this off consistently with ease.

Anyhow this is going off a tangent. The game mechanics are obviously going to be the most difficult thing to get right. I look forward to trying this out.

Mm, your dodge movement is basically how jumping works in my project atm.

A bit wonky tbh!

Genuinely looks nice.
Looking forward to a playable test release!
Exciting times!

Thanks! We cant wait to have people beta test it when we get to that point. :D

Count me in!

Also people who donate a certain amount to the kickstarter can become part of a think tank and get special access even before alpha. Just a heads up if you are really eager. :D

Aw man, shouldn't have bought that new apartment then :()

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=236501088

Hey all, we finally gout our Greenlight up and running. Kickstarter is not that long around the bend! That's for all of your support thus far. :D

Voted yes. Good luck.

It's not E L O, it's E-low :)

Tactile and tactical are also different words. Hope they take this kind of stuff more seriously in the future because that was just bad.

It was a late night. And technically it was both right. the tactile pare is only in singleplayer campaign. And considering the time I spent with the motion graphics, I put quite a bit of effort into the video.

Hi, Congratulations on your Steam Greenlight. However I was just going to voice some concerns, because I want this project to succeed, and so far it doesn't look like anything special:

1) You mentioned plenty of times your "unique" movement system, but in it's current state it is almost EXACTLY like that of 'Red Eclipse'.
Everything from the spacebar wall-jump, to the wall-running by pressing an action key. The only element that is different is the wall grapple, and I'm guessing you got that from Titanfall. This is something you might wanna look into, because the movement is too similar to Red Eclipse to not look copied.

2) What sets this game apart from other Arena FPS?
As of now the weapons look generic (although you mentioned the addition stun and knock-back weapons, which sounded interesting), the movement is derivative, and the Borderland-esque, cartoony artstyle has been done by Warsow. It isn't unique enough in it's own genre, let alone as a separate game.

3) Tell us about the "expansive single player with a rich lore that carries over into the multiplayer"?
IMO story and world-building are crucial, and no other Arena FPS has had a decent one. This could certainly make Project Nex stand out. But since you haven't given any details, it seems more of an afterthought rather than a focus. The only content you've shown that pertains to the story is some concept art of a stereotypical alien.

Don't get me wrong, I want this game to succeed, and I want to support the kick-starter. But from what you've shown, I don't see anything promising.

#1: So it's somewhat similar to a game nobody knows about? How unique can movement get? At some point, every game overlaps with another. It boils down to how they implement these overlaps that defines them. I looked at Red Eclipse just now and the games seemingly look and feel very different, even with their utilization of "similar mechanics."

In the grand scheme of things, nothing is unique. So in the end, big deal.

#2: See #1. Again, arena FPS has a definition, how far can one deviate from it before it isn't an arena shooter? There isn't even a playable game yet, wait and see?

#3: I think single player is utterly useless but hey, I can see single player bringing in new players.

Not to say I'm a fanboy, have any hopes of this game or even cared enough to look at their Greenlight page, I just think you're basing your arguments on elements that will always be present.

" I just think you're basing your arguments on elements that will always be present."

I was NOT making arguments AT ALL, I was asking questions, them being:
"Is the movement truly unique?"
"What sets Project Nex apart from other Arena FPS?"
"what about the story and lore you promised?"
All of which have been answered by PrettyAwesome

"how far can one deviate from it before it isn't an arena shooter?"

Very far, there are countless ideas and systems that can be implemented. Class systems, character body types, jetpacks, weapon customisation, energy meters, turbo boost sprint, certain destroyable sections of the map (without compromising gameplay). I'm not saying all of this should be in there, I'm just listing the possibilities. It will still be an Arena FPS, just not "Old School"

Ultimately it will be derivative in some way or another -we live in a derivative world- but largely unique.

1) We actually never heard of Red Eclipse until it was mentioned a few days ago. I played it and was far, far from impressed. They do have wall running, but in Nex you are sliding on the wall. It sounds superficial, but its not. It feels much different and behaves differently. And we didn't get grapple from Titanfall, none of us have had the opportunity to play it. Even if we are using mechanics from other genres, at the end of the day its our implementation of it all that matters the most.

2) As I sit now replying to this message I have 3ds max up modelling some weapons to show off here soon. We will have unique weapons that other arena fps are too scared to try because its too different. Though there are some core fundamental weapons that I am keeping on our game too. The Warsaw comparison is beginning to get annoying. Especially because we really don't have much on the actual in game art to show to make any reasonable opinion.

Warsaw saw TF2 and just added an outline shader to that. Project Nex saw Borderlands and pulled the texturing style from it. I also like the Mirrors Edge look, and we are marrying the two. For singleplayer it makes sense, they style is there to help convey the singleplayer story better.

3.) We'll have more info on story soon. It'll be the first arena fps to actually have a good story, and not that abomination of a story UT3 had. It was so bad.

" The Warsaw comparison is beginning to get annoying. Especially because we really don't have much on the actual in game art to show to make any reasonable opinion."

I don't mean to annoy you, and I know you've shown very little for me to form an opinion. I only said what I said because you mentioned in a video that you wanted a borderlands-type artstyle, which has been done to death. Assholes would be quick to judge a game if it looks similar to another.
I'm just hoping the art style is distinct, unique and difficult to mistake for anything else. Games like Gears of War with it's giant armour clad soldiers and chainsaw guns; Brink with it's caricature/parkour/punk influences; or Bioshock with it's dreary and violent underwater distopia are just a couple of examples.

"It'll be the first arena fps to actually have a good story"
I sincerely hope so, 'cause that would be awesome.

"I have 3ds max up modelling some weapons to show off here soon."
I'm genuinely looking forward to it, best of luck man :)

Question: Warsow has been greenlighted for more than six months now and there are no news on the matter, it even seems likely that it will never actually get on steam.

Did you do anything in order to prevent this happening to your project too? (assuming you get greenlighted obviously)

We would take it further than to let it sit. I think they only Greenlit to get their game seen by people on Steam and to get a boost of players.

already voted on greenlight...
...but these alien concept arts are fail imo

Thanks for the vote! I quite like the concepts. Its just a matter of opinions on that one.

I'm very excited for a new type of arena FPS in the later quarter of this year :) However, the health system/regeneration system is quite new in the arena shooter. I like the whole energy pool idea for weapons, even though quake/ut style is still my favorite :).

I've been playing UT/Quake since around 2009(I didn't get into it until high school). As a UT3 player, I love the movement system implemented into this game, considering UT3 is my favorite movement system of all arena shooters(maybe besides CPMA).

If you like UT3, you'll be pretty at home in Nex. Just takes getting used to the gravity settings and so on for wall jump and side dodge. The grappling and sliding really bring it to life though.

i would like to know, what would make me play this over warsow or quake?
ut-like weapons sounds awful, and the movement just seem like a weird combination of quake and ut movement with walljumps from warsow :E

would love to try it though, cant really say shit before :p

Our movement implementation is better. It actually melds really well together. Lots of cool trickjumps you can do with it.

We plan on having an alpha out before the end of the year. I was the sole game artist for the project, we finally got another person, so it should speed things up much more.

Is there an aircontrol mechanic that let's you move somewhat freely in the air? Otherwise trick jumps will be extremely boring.

Yep. You get air control. :D

Lots of cool trickjumps doesn't equal good gameplay though.
for instance warsow used to have it so u could do 2 walljumps in a row in earlier versions, but it got removed because fights turned into shit when people just kept bouncing around like some fucking pinballs.
and in 0.5 they made weapons stun players(making them unable to wj for acouple of seconds) to reduce the wj-whoring.

Do you not think it will be somewhat the same in Nex ? or is your overall movement so much slower than warsows that it won't be a problem ?

Voted, favourited, following, good luck!

Thanks for your support!

WROCKET JUMBPING!!!

Time to let everyone from ESR interested in testing into a playable demo.

We'll turn it into Quake in no timehueheuhuehuehueheueue.

In due time, in due time.

If people want to play a Quake clone with no originality there are a few games in production that are offering to bring nothing new to the table.

Saying your project isn't derivative is a bit of a stretch at the moment. You'll have to come up with more than a concept of an energy suit that powers the same old mechanics from other games to be considered original. I'm putting some faith in you not to be another Warsow, Nexuiz, Xonotic, etc. and especially not another Quake or Unreal Tournament. When the time comes, you have my sword.

So you think double tapping to double jump is annoying and you want to avoid double tapping as much as possible?

What about double tapping keys to dodge? By your logic its annoying and you want to avoid it, right?

Double tapping for everything is annoying. There are going to be alternative control methods for people who dislike it.

Thanks man.

sign me up for alpha testing ;o
ut2k4 player from 2004-2010
Q3/QL player 2008-present

biased towards UT

[censored rant here]

the first brick wall you will run into with the game as it is, is that if players can start and stop moving so quickly, on all surfaces, combat will be blindingly short simple fights which no one will find compelling. hope this helps.

e: oh and hitscan won't work. at all.

For those who are bias towards UT weapons;

Quake and UT are two different games in the same genre. I will admit that UT has some trouble with the balance, while Quake has more balance within it's weapon system, but hands down I prefer UT weapons over Quake. The reasoning is because of the movement system makes it capable of having overpowered weapons. You can dodge a shot in UT more easily than you can even avoid a shot in Quake.