btw sorry im quite stoned

Short answer: No.

Long answer: Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo.

So funny that even allah would skip the suicide stuff and just give you 72 virgins.

simpsons did it

are you saying the DA @ 1800dpi is the same as IE3?

or that the DA @ 450dpi is same as IE3?

DA @ 450dpi is same as IE3

its funny you say that because my WMO1.1A behaves as though it has 450dpi, even though all the documentation ive found says it has 400dpi.

its possible that the newer/some batch of WMO and IE3s use a 450dpi sensor, which would explain why your sens is the same as your DA @ 450dpi.

can you show the calculations?

450dpi is 1/8 more dpi than 400dpi so i removed 1/8 of my sensitivity (4,2->3,7) but that doesnt give me the same cm/360°
the same sensitvity (4,2) which I've used with my IE 3.0 gives me the same cm/360°

DA loses some precission on certain surfaces, which makes it read less CPI. CPI is overrated anyways, most people will never need more than 800CPI, and some players will never need more than 400CPI. No skipping within normal operating speed and precise tracking is the only thing that matters when it comes to sensors IMO.

agree. I dont need more dpi than 400. I just wanna know if its true

Old ones were 1800DPI (august 2007 and older), not sure about the newer ones.

can you set DA to 450 as a default value so you don't have to set it every time? (without drivers fcourse)

Firmware 1.21 (needs driver 1.08 to be able to change DPI) and above keeps the DPI setting on the mouse itself.

so you'd need to install the drivers, set the dpi, uninstall the drivers?

You can just disable "razerhid.exe" in the startup list, which is the filter driver for DA. You can just start up the driver with razerhid.exe, but unfortunatly you can't unload the driver without rebooting as it will BSOD the computer if you stop the proccess (happens on my computer atleast).

nah I prefer no drivers at all. I remember reading somewhere that you can store your settings in an inbuilt mouse memory in DA, like turn off the glowing lights, dpi etc.

Razerhid.exe is the driver ffs, if it doesn't start there is no driver loaded. Simple as that. Lights is not stored in the mouse btw, only DPI and afaik hz.

I don't want to disable anything, I want to uninstall drivers altogether. was considering buying this as my laptop mouse since IE 3.0 is not availible here and people say it's almost the same as IE on 450dpi. have you maybe comped these two mice?

Different shape, IE 3.0 is slightly larger (longer and wider). Think of DA as IE 3.0 without the pinky rest and slightly shorter. Don't remember the height difference.

Don't really see the point in uninstalling drivers since you have to reinstall->reboot->uninstall->reboot, whenever you change something. By disabling driver startup the driver is never loaded, so it is the same compared to not having drivers installed installed. When you want to change DPI then you just start driver->change DPI->reboot, driver will now not be loaded when razerhid.exe startup is disabled. Pretty much saves install time and 1 reboot.

thanks for info.

to answer your question.

i uninstalled my drivers and it kept the DPI and polling rate. everything else doesn't stay with the mouse (lights on or off, razer mouse sensitivity, other useless crap)

at their widest points the D.A. is actually slightly wider, but somehow it doesn't feel that way in your hand. Go double check, I didn't believe it at first either. The I.E. is still more comfortable imo, but since I'd already ordered the Hyperglides I might as well actually use it.

you're doing it wrong.

from to 450 to 400 you have to remove 1/9th.
from 400 to 450 you would have to add 1/8th.

50 extra CPI will feel faster even if you calculate your sensitivity.

Yup, its just a matter of getting used to the extra responsiveness.

he's saying he doesn't feel it though,

Honestly I don't know wtf he's saying. Sounds like a crackhead wrote it.

I wrote i was quite stoned at this time

I love how even though you edited your post you still failed to construct a proper sentence.

is your IE3 from the recent re-release (dark-grey casing) or from an older batch (light-grey/white case)? i ask because the newer ones sensors run at 600dpi instead of 400dpi, which would explain the difference. i have just recently bought one, as my DA was a bit to heavy for my taste and at my current sensitivity i don't have a need for such a high dpi count. tripling my sens produced the same cm/360 on the IE3@600dpi as i had with my DA@1800dpi, so either your DA is faulty or you made a mistake in your calculations.

new IE 3.0 has 400dpi. That are just rumors that new IE 3.0 has more dpi than the old one.

i got DA yesterday

using 5.65 sens in q3 i do 810 degrees in 40cm (length of mousemat (3.0 intellimouse)

using 5.65 sens in q3 i do 810 degrees in 40cm (length of mousemat (Deathadder)

exactly the same :) just chill out and get on with it, the ie most probably has 450dpi, remember, razer and microsoft kinda worked together at one point :)

nice. have you tried moving it real fast back and forth? how about neg accel, ingame feel etc?

hmm, yeh i have across length of mousemat. taking into account human error by moving the mouse slightly more/less.... then i conclude @ 450dpi and 5.65 - sometimes neg/sometimes pos = no accel atall... same for 1800dpi and 1.412 (approx)... no accel :)

im not 100% adapted to mouse yet, feels slightly different in my hand than 3.0 intellimouse.. but i think it will be the best mouse i have used :)

3.0 has 400 dpi
D.A. does not have that setting.

With that stated, I've actually had no luck using the 450 DPI because the liftoff distance is higher at that dpi than at 1800.

So I set it to 1800dpi @ 500hz and lowered the master sensitivity in Razer's software (read: Not windows sens), and it now feels like a dream.

My current settings in the software can be seen here:
http://exg-clan.com/newforum/viewtopic.php?p=78887#78887

Honestly, it's way better than setting it to 450dpi (imho) because of the liftoff distance at 450.

Also, do yourself a favor if you're using the D.A. and get some Hyperglides for it. The stock feet feel more like rubber than teflon.

oh sounds interessting because I bought a new mousepad to lower the lift-off distance but its even higher now :o
On my old mousepad qck+ the DA doesnt track on 2 CDs anymore but on the new mousepad everglide fnatic edition it needs 3 CDs to dont track anymore. I hope they will change the chart in the Deathadder guide

I will test it tomorrow at 1800dpi although my DA skipped at 1800dpi (in a neg/pos accel test) but maybe it wont happen when I follow your advise to lower the sensitivity in Razor's software. Everyone recommed to lower windows sensitivity. Is there any benefit lowering Razor's sensitivity instead of the windows one?

I wont use a mouse without hyperglides ;)

Well, I've had my D.A. for quite awhile, but was still using my I.E. 3.0 until the Hyperglides came in last week.
I'm using the Allsop Raindrop XL mousepad, for reference.

Also, check that screenshot i posted, it should show firmware and driver version. It's not the latest, but I dont' like the latest (this is my 2nd D.A., first one bricked on me in a couple days)

In Sujoy's mouse review of the D.A., it actually showed more accurate tracking at 1800dpi than the other 2 settings.
If you have any other inquiries drop 'em by me. We apparently have similar taste in peripherals.

Your settings look almost identical to mine.

Also, the acceleration settings are bunk in the Razer drivers. They're not recorded in the .conf files that are generated by the drivers, either. It worked at the desktop, so I tried seeing if the acceleration worked in Q3, and with in_mouse -1 it didn't seem to work unless I did cl_mouseaccel > 0, at which point it seemed to compound with the Razer drivers' setting, making it hard to use. I didn't test in_mouse 1 because quake3.exe has problems with clicks registering/sticking when that's used with high sample rate mice :/

uh sujoys test didnt show more accuracy at 1800 it showed a higher speed for malfunction that is all. it would start to skip at a higher speed then it would at 450 dpi.

please stop spreading false info.

"uh sujoys test didnt show more accuracy at 1800 it showed a higher speed for malfunction that is all"
"please stop spreading false info."

lol
you're retarded.

ok i have the same sensitivity and 1800dpi in the razor driver. It is really the same cm/360° as it is on 450dpi. The skipping doesnt happened anymore at very fast mouse movements but unfortunaly it doesnt lower the lift-off distance on my fnatic pad. I will keep this setting because of the max speed of almost 3,92 m/s.

yeah, there's still a noticeable liftoff tracking that I wasn't getting with the 3.0, but for whatever reason i get liftoff tracking at nearly a full half inch when i am at 450dpi, which is insanely high to still be moving around. Apparently I'm the only one having that particular issue at 450dpi (it's unusable for me).
Anonymous said it's probably my mousepad (Allsop Raindrop XL), and I'm inclined to agree. Any body ever used the Death Adder with the SS 5L?

i heard alot of people complaining about tracking and skipping on qck heavy and other cheap pads.

ive used the DA on an exactmat and on the mantis speed and control and liftoff distance was pretty low on all 3.

My QCK heavy behaves properly, as does the Everglide Titan I've used, but the cheaper cloth pads (generics, supermats) don't do as well with it.

I had liftoff problems with some firmware revisions (not the initial one and not the most recent, but it was at least 2 of the ones between), and use a QCK heavy and have no problems with liftoff.

The CD thing is a good trick...never thought of that! Thx.

Also, I'm staring at my 2 year old (or whatever) IE3.0 re-release box, and it claims 9000fps, 25g max acceleration and 54ips max speed...I think I remember digging up comparable numbers and the re-release had a different sensor/controller that had slightly different specs than the original, due to the original sensor/controller being discontinued.

Drivers add quite a bit of latency to both tracking and button presses with DA though. If you can do without drivers it is better to use driver less.

are you like unhuman with response time of like 0.0005 seconds? i dont notice any lag

It is very noticable in Q3 and Q4 when you try to rail someone, the shot feels like its buffered for 2-3 frames extra which makes shots not go where you intended them to. LG is even worse, since it takes longer time for the beam to move, which makes it hard to track people who are good at dodging.

sure its not your monitor input lag? or your drivers? faulty mouse? or your own personal reaction time being too slow thats making you not be able to keep up with the dodging? because its fine for me

i just tried throwing my mouse accross my mousemat into my hand, no delay from mouse direction change to on screen that i can see

im not saying that there isnt delay, theyre is no doubt delay in every mouse on the market, im simply saying, its not as noticable as you say and imo for me, completely free of it and i am still hitting the same accs as i did with 3.0

cl_placebo 1

Believe me it is there. The tracking delay is very noticable when doing fast flickshots with rail or trying to track with LG with cg_Truelightning 0. It is in sudden direction or speed change that you really notice the tracking delay. The button delay is easy, just put your crosshair at a choke position and see how much easier it is to hit targets on reaction shots without the driver delay. Of course this is on a CRT which has very little delay, if you play on a TFT you might not notice it as much since you are used to the TFT delay on top of input and game latency.

The razer filter drivers lie between the raw input and the OS and does system calls for the mouse. This causes the delay. Playing with razer drivers felt like having mosuefilter set to 2 or 3 samples.

i will test with truelighning 0 later... if it turns out their is lag... can i play with 450dpi without drivers?

Firmware 1.21 and later saves CPI. You will notice it when moving the LG from side to side, it responds slightly faster without drivers. If you open up task manager, razerhid should not be running. Only way to disable razer drivers is to stop their startup process "razerhid.exe" from running on boot.

I'm sure I'll get railed on for mentioning it, but actually i kinda think you're right. I am normally a reflex railer, and I'd adapted to become more of a prediction/ leading railer after switching to the D.A. from the 3.0

Just so people understand, it's almost like rail in Q2, as far as how it feels when railing with the Death Adder. (my experience, more than once)

this may be true for your mouse but not for everyone.

I'm using 450 dpi and its the same exact liftoff distance at 1800 dpi.

i blame your mousepad. im using the mantis control and liftoff distance is less then 2 dvd discs stacked up at 450 dpi and at 1800 dpi.

I wouldn't use the drivers also they are junk. i only use them for cod4 so that i can use macros and since that game isn't so fast paced a little input lag doesn't hurt.

DEATHADDER = 1600 DPI

http://razerblueprints.net/index.php/componen.../#msg64994

"From my experience deathadder have got 1600 dpi. How can i know this?

1) Disable all forms of pointer aceleration in any SO in which I try this, and setting pointer speed for a relation 1:1 (at windoze: 6/11 at linux xset -m 0 0 or 1 1 and/or when Xserver is launched: /usr/bin/X -a 0)
2) 4 example 4 my desktop in windoze with razer drivers and in linux (without drivers Tongue ) i use a screen resolution of 1680x1050. Then if a move my mouse only in the X axis, ill move the pointer through 1680 pixels in the screen.
Then with the help of a rule and a triangle I can measure the distance that the mouse runs over the mousepad for this 1680 pixels.

For 450dpi mouse settings I got 10.6 cm in the mousepad, for 900dpi: 5.3cm, and finally for 1800dpi: 2.65cm

1inch = 2.54cm

10.6cm--->4.2 inches ----> 1680 (pixels or dots Tongue ) : 4.2 (inches) = 400 dots per inch Sad --> 400 real dpi 4 a mouse setting of 450dpi
....
2.65 -----> 1680 : 1.05 = 1600 real dpi Sad

This little experiment was done with 1.10 & 1.25 mouse firmware (@lnx&windoze) with the same results."

;)

Depends on version, there is one with 1800 and one with 1600. I have one of each. The one with 1800 DPI starts with PM0742 as serial and has a white rectangular box around the model number with black background inside the box. The box is to the right of the serial. Model number in this box is "RAZ-RZ01-0015001(B)". The 1600DPI model doesn't have this box. There is another box with model number in the normal place as well which says "RZ01-0015001" This is with firmware 1.27.

I have the "RAZ-RZ01-0015001(B)" one and it still have 1600 dpi. I have tested it with the method that is described above.

I bought it in J-2008 and it has the 1.10 firmware.
The box that you described:
Razer (Asia-Pacific) Pte Ltd
MIC (something in chinese)
RAZ-RZ01-0015001(B)

My serial: PM0738...

And the mouse "announces" (at anywhere you look), that it has 1800 dpi. That is misleading advertising by Razer like when they put in their mouses (diamondback plasma also) an infrared led and they knows that with a red one, the sensor works much better and is less problematic.

Mine has true 1800DPI, and is far more sensitive than the old one (1.4 sens with this one equals aprox 1.52 sens with old one). Comparing 900DPI to an "800DPI mouse mode" (mx518) gives 1.4sens equals aprox. 1.68 sens. Measuring by drawing a line/moving it across screen etc. is far too inacurate since we are talking about 1 inch. Moving it .05 inches equals moving it 90 pixels. The only way to properly test it is to count raw mouseinput (through a program) and moving it atleast 5 inches, preferably 10-20 inches as the error margin becommes smaller. Also the height the mouse is above the surface influences the DPI. Adding hyperglides will make the mouse higher above the surface which results inn lower DPI count. This applies to quite a few other mice as well. Never really understood people's obsession with DPI as 800DPI is all most people who don't play at very high res with high sens will ever need.

FFS, i have the same problem.
Also does this piece of crap, now weights ~10g more and the liftoff-distance is twice as high as with my old deathadder, which had a s/n like 005XXX, and now that i can compare had true 1800DPI.
The new ones came with firmware 1.27 and has the s/n 001510XXX, and is clearly slower, as i dont reach as far ingame when i move the mouse from left to right of my mousepad. :(((

Well the DA dpi depends of:
a) The type of surface
b) Distance to the surface (MouseSkates influence)
c) Firmware version
[ d) All DAs arent exactly the same: "built tolerances" ]
========================================

My experience with 450dpi setting:

With firmwares 1.10,1.25.1.27 and almost standar mouse skates: 400-410 dpi over several surfaces.

With 1.28 NDC and the same skates: 430dpi
With 1.28 NDC and without skates: 445-450dpi
With 1.28 NDC and ~1.5-2mm mouse skates (near of the liftoff distance for the surface): ~380dpi (if i dont remember bad...)

Never really thought to check if Razer was telling the truth but the Deathadder is the only mouse I will use as the baby is virtually IMPOSSIBLE TO CLIP :D *low sens whores FTW* I find it very accurate with either the old 1.27 firmware or the new 1.28 and have owned 2. One right when it came out and one like 4 months ago. Both felt the same; Fells like home :). The mouse definitely feels like its had a few coffees with the newest firmware though. VERY lively and responsive and still as brutally accurate, if more due to the removal of prediction. Also Its very interesting you are claiming that it has 1600 dpi with all the crap they have on their site about true DPI and what not. Very bad press if your findings are true. Maybe the intellimouse had 450? sounds more likely as they never advertised the dpi like Razer has.

New IntelliMice have 450DPI

I won't bother until it's over 9000

I've compared it with the old DA i own.
When I do 360° in quake with a given sensitivty from left to right side of my mousemat, the new ones does only about 300° with the same settings and same procedure.
The same distance i reach with my old Diamondback BTW.

Old diamond back as in 1600 dpi or old diamond back as in the 3g one :P?

the old 1600DPI Diamondback, of course

Here is the proof that it has not the promised DPI:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dbcouDr4Zxw

Find a new sens suiting you and then stick with that. Problem solved.

2nd part: liftoff-distance:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECdI0_wZxVc

and some pics of the dissambled mice:
http://img190.imageshack.us/gal.php?g=alim0790.jpg

Supposedly the latest firmware fixes this issue.

Oh, there is a FW 1.29 yet?
cuz I used 1.28 already on both mice.